Regular Meeting

[music] Hey, hey, hey. Heat. Heat. N. Call to order the May 28th meeting of the Kerry Town Council. And at this time, I'll recognize Council Member Richards for our ceremonial opening.

Thank you, Mayor. Well, last time I had the honor of giving the ceremonial

opening, we also had a packed gallery. So, I will just say thank you to everybody assembled here. It is always wonderful to hear resident voices and I applaud you for being part of the democratic process. Continuing my uh gratitude, I would like to point out that earlier this month, we celebrated teacher appreciation week and May is also considered teacher appreciation month. And as I have told all of my children's school teachers, I was grateful for them prior to the pandemic, but after a year and a half of remote learning, I was exceptionally grateful for our professional educators who educate our children. Uh part of our role on council is doing some constituent education and in describing what different parts of government have responsibility for what. And so, of course, the town does not have responsibility for our schools, but our schools and our teachers are valued parts of our community. And that includes council member Craig, who is herself a public school teacher. And I am aed that she is able to serve our community in both of these capacities simultaneously, council member and teacher. So, as part of teacher appreciation month, thank you council member Craig as well. And so with that, [applause] with that, let's stand for the pledge of allegiance, please.

To the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, Mr. Richards, and thank you, Miss Craig.

First order of business is to adopt the agenda. I would entertain a motion to do so.

So moved.

Second.

There's a motion and a second. Discussion. All in favor, please say I.

I.

Any oppose? Motion carries unanimously. We are now at recognitions, reports, and presentations. Our first presentation is the Jewish American Heritage Month proclamation and and I will invite Mayor Pro Tim Lori Bush and Council Member Brittany Richards to join our special guests at the podium for the presentation.

Yes. Thank you, Mayor. And I'll ask Lexi Newell to join me at the podium or join Council Member Richards and I at the podium. [applause] All right. So, for those of you who don't know, has anybody ever done an ancestry and me or 23 andme or ancestry.com? Yeah. Were you surprised? Well, I am a I am an oddity. I am a 100% Ashkanazi Jew. the big it was a big circle. It looked like a big target. Um, so I also asked Britney Richards, who's also the second member on the Kerry Town Council right now, um, who's also a Jewish American, uh, to join me. So, we're going to do this in tandem if we can.

And I should say I am honored that Mayor Prom Bush invited me to join you because full disclosure, I am 50% Ashkanazi Jew. [laughter]

We'll do it together. But I was a full 50%.

That's good. Yes,

that's good.

All right. Well, I I will start. So, where uh also let's do it a little bit more fun. When I say whereas, everybody say whereas. Let's try it.

Oh, this is I've never had a full house for this. This [laughter] is so awesome. So,

Jewish American Heritage Month is observed each May to celebrate the history, culture, and contributions of Jewish Americans and to encourage residents to learn more about Jewish heritage. and ver

the Jewish American community includes more than 7 million people in the United States including residents of Kerry who have made lasting contributions to all aspects of American life and continue to enrich our community and

Jewish Americans have contributed significantly to the advancement of the arts of sciences, education, business, public service and civic life, helping to strengthen communities across the nation. And here in Kerry and

Kerry is proud to recognize and celebrate its Jewish American residents and their ongoing impact on the strength and diversity of our community. Now therefore, I Lori Bush, Mayor Prom, on behalf of our esteemed mayor and all of the council colleagues, proclaim May 2026 as Jewish American Heritage Month and encourage residents to learn about and appreciate Jewish American heritage and reflect on the experiences of our Jewish American community.

[applause]

Mayor and Mayor Prom, on behalf of the greater Raleigh Kerry Jewish community, I want to thank you and Kerry Town Council for this meaningful proclamation recognizing our Jewish Heritage Month. This recognition is a reminder of the strength and beauty of community itself. At a time when it can be so easy to focus on what makes us different, moments like this call us back to the values that I know that we share. Compassion, service, and a desire to build a more caring and connected Carrie

together. I'm deeply gra deeply grateful to live in a place that values inclusion and honors diverse traditions, especially in times like these. I thank you for standing with the Jewish community, for making this proclamation, and helping to create a carry where all people feel seen and valued. Thank you.

Thank you. [applause] I wanted to take a moment because as we mark Jewish American Heritage Month, I've been thinking not only about the many contributions that many of my Jewish friends have made to the community, but also about the world our children are inheriting right now. We're living through a time of rising anti-semitism, not only in the United States, but across the globe. From harassment to vandalism to threats and violence, it should really trouble us all, not just Jewish Americans. As the granddaughter of a Holocaust survivor, I don't have the luxury of treating anti-semitism as an abstract problem. It's personal and it's in my everyday thoughts. But hatred rarely travels alone. We've also seen mosques and Islamic centers and a Hindu temple here in Kerry that was vandalized which sends scary messages to us all. And when any house of worship is attacked, every person of faith or not of faith, every person of conscious should feel it too. You know, I'm reminded of a story that I shared with some of my fellow council members from St. Louis that stayed with me as someone who grew up in St. Louis. In 2017, hundreds of headstones in my grandmother's Jewish cemetery were toppled over in an apparent anti-Semitic act. You know who showed up to help? The Muslim community. The Muslim community and members launched a fundraiser to

help repair the damage. They raised well over $100,000 far beyond their initial goal to restore those graves. And in a moment that was meant to spread fear and hate and violence, they chose solidarity instead. And to me, that is the America that I love and should be working towards every day, where we're in the compassion of one another, where we refuse to let anyone's hatred dictate how we see each other. So, as this month comes to a close, it's what I choose to focus on rather than the rising tide of anti-semitism, but carries love of diversity that is in our DNA. So, I really hope that it's a simple request that we all use this moment to look back with pride, but also look forward together with some sort of purpose. To call out anti-semitism when we see it, but also to call out any type of hate when we see it, to stand against Islamophobia and all forms of bigotry. And I hope that each of us in this room will show up for each other across lines of faith, of race, of background. And when we're at our best, we're part of the caring Kerry community. And I really thank you for allowing me to recognize today for the first time, I believe, [clears throat] in my council history. Thank you.

Thank you, Miss. [applause] Very well said. [clears throat] Our second presentation is the safe soil proclamation and I'll invite council member Bella to join [clears throat] our special guest at the podium for the presentation.

Uh I would love to invite Miss Jema and her youth volunteer to the podium.

Um I joined uh the safe soil walkathon a few weeks ago and it's really a great event for me and a lot of knowledge for me because um there are so many because Carrie just care about our environment so much and I learned that only 3% on earth 3% of the earth's soil a healthy soil right and I learned some numbers is that right if we have correct me

the numbers

yeah if we meet 6% we will have enough food for our future generations

right um so we need three to six% of organic content in the soil for it to be able to produce food

and uh right now 50% of agricultural soils all over the world are deficient. They are below one or 1.5%.

Oh wow.

The scientists have known for a while.

Mhm. Um and we are just trying to say that to the common man to remind them that we need to put it just all we need to do is move from one to 3% and the soil will do all that it's meant to do like giving us food keeping our uh water inside it instead of letting floods you know water to flow down and wash away the dirt. So no floods no droughts and it can also keep the carbon inside the soil. If the organic content is three to six% it can keep the carbon in the soil and outside the air. So

she can talk endlessly [laughter] because the uh that day u mi um m shama shared a lot of feelings and I really feel that I'm connected to the earth and it's really so I understand how important for us to protect our soil. So let's finish the proclamation first and we'll continue. [laughter] Um whereas healthy soil supports nearly every aspect of daily life from the food

we grow and the trees that shade our neighborhoods to the water quality of our creeks and the resilience of our environment. And whereas Carrie recognized that protecting and restoring soil health is an important part of long-term environmental stewardship, helping uh infiltrate storm water, reduce erosion, support pollinators, and sustain healthy landscapes and ecosystems. And whereas Kerry advances these efforts through composting and organic waste diversion programs that transform food scraps, leaves and yard waste into nutritionrich compost that is returned to the soil [snorts] as well as through the care of public gardens, trees, parks and green infrastructures throughout the community. And whereas the safe soil movement encourages communities around the world to recognize the importance of soil conservation and sustainable practices that help protect nature natural resources for future generations. And now therefore, I council member Bella Huang on behalf of the Kerry Mayor and Council do hereby recognize the safe soil movement in and encourage residents to reflect on the important role healthy soil plays in supporting a resilient, sustainable and thriving community proclaimed in 28th day of May 2026. Now your turn. [applause] Okay. Um, thank first of all, okay, thank you so much Bella Hang uh for recognizing safe soil as something important and for bringing this proclamation. And hello Kerry Council

members. I'm so excited to meet you all today and have a chance to talk about soil. Um, so my name is Taruna Sharma Patil and I'm a mom, engineer and a safe soil volunteer today. So I have three roles and as a mom I have always wanted um a healthy and abundant future for my children and uh as an engineer I always have to dig into the root cause to find out how. So with my research I have found that healthy soil will create healthy food because most 90% of our food grows in soil. Uh however scientists have reported that 50% of our agricultural soil which creates majority of the food that we consume is deficient. So how can our food be healthy if the soil creating it is deficient? And uh and the projection is that by 2050 90% of this soil will be deficient. What that means is that the organic content has fallen below 1%. So when soil is deficient, it cannot grow food that we can eat. It cannot hold water and hence it'll cause it will not protect us from floods and droughts. It cannot keep the carbon inside. The carbon will flow out and create global warming and we will have extreme climates. We have already seen that happen around us and so safe soil movement is trying to bring our focus on the root cause just as an engineer would look at the soil all we need to do is move it from 1% to 3%. So that is something that I would like to put out as a hopeful uh you know hopeful number 3% that's it uh just raise the organic content as a person as an individual each of us can compost in our backyards but that's not going to help the global agricultural soils upgrade their nutrition content and hence the nutrition of all the hundreds of

children that are going to go out there in the world and create their future and when I look out as to what I leave in this world when I go when I go I feel it's my responsibility to to bring this to to everybody's uh you know viewpoint and uh this is all I can do but you guys have a lot more powers and um like Mother Teresa said uh I can not change the world all alone. All I can do is cast a stone in the water that can create many many ripples. And uh I wish that Kerry creates a lot of ripples and we all love soil as our source of life and recognize our responsibility. Thank you. [applause]

Thank you. Thank you so much, Town of Kerry, for making this proclamation possible. Um, I say this all the time, but environmental or decisions made today heavily impact our youth generations and especially when it's time for us to lead. So, the proclamation like this means something's working. So, um, I want to think of this as a step closer to safety, a step a step closer to a secure future, and this really could not have happened without all of your support. So, thank you so much truly.

[applause]

I would love to recognize all the youth volunteers uh from safe soil to stand up and show everyone. Thank you so much for your work. [applause]

Thank you so much. Our third presentation is the mental health awareness month proclamation and once again council member Bella Huang will invite special guests to the podium for the presentation.

Yeah, me again. Uh it's Emily from uh

Lucy Daniel. Oh, sorry you're just here [laughter] and also BNK uh the volunteers from there. Um let me uh before uh reading the proclamation I want to briefly refle I reflect on the importance of um mental health awareness. Mental health is becoming more and more important for families in our community. And I want to thank you all the community partners, hospitals, counselors, and [snorts] um uh nonprofit organization partners, hospitals, EMS personnels, and caregivers who support residents every day. And and I want to especially recognize the Lucy Daniel Center, which has served children with autism since 1989. and they they're working hard to toward expanding integrated education and therapy services together on one campus which could which would be a tremendous help for many ASD families including families like mine and they need donations now and also want to recognize BNK studio the twin brothers they um founded a nonprofit supporting the ESD community The story started with uh started with their cousin who has diagnosed with ASD at a very young age. So the boys decided to start a nonprofit and I'm wearing this scarf and there are young artists they design it and made it and also with the toes and the foundaries from selling their uh art u online and also the AR art galleries to um foundaries and more. They have done a lot and I would love to um thank them. They just donated $3,000 to Kerry uh Green Hope High and Green

Level High Schools uh two months ago and this year I I think last year they fund raised about 9,000 and this year their goal is 16,000 for high school students. It's amazing. Thank you so much. And I'll just read the proclamation and wait for them to say something. [laughter] Whereas mental health is an important part of overall health and well-being affecting individuals, families, schools, workplaces, and broader community. And whereas mental health awareness month provides an opportunity to raise awareness, reduce stigma, encourage open conversations, and remind those facing mental health challenges that support and resources are available. And whereas Carrie values a healthy, connected and compassionate community and recognize the importance of the promoting mental wellness, resilience and access to support supportive services for residents of all ages. And whereas care encourages residents, community organizations, schools, businesses, and health care providers to work together to foster understandings, understanding, kindness, and support the for those impacted by mental health challenges. Now therefore, I, Council Member Bella Huang, on behalf of the Kerry Mayor and Council, do hereby proclaim May 2026 as mental health awareness month in Kerry, North Carolina, and encourage residents to increase awareness of mental health and support one another to help build a more caring and inclusive community. Proclaim this 28th day of May, 2026. I'll first uh thank you and I'll invite Emily from uh Lucy Daniel.

Thank you, Council Member Wong, Kerry Town Council. It's an honor to be here. Thank you for having me. Um I'm the director of Lucy Daniels Center and I brought with me our education director and between the two of us uh we have spent 30 years at Lucy Daniel Center and so I would just love to share some of what we have come to learn about mental health and especially young child mental health. Mental health is one of those terms that can be used to describe so many things that it's both meaningful and also meaningless. So what do I think of when I consider mental health? It has to do with one's ability to live a good life, a meaningful life, a connected life. It's how do we form relationships? How do we take pride in our work and find purpose? The ability to feel whatever we feel and to know that all emotions are safe and can be communicated. And there are a multitude of things that can impact mental health. biology, neurology, trauma, painful generational patterns, overwhelming national and international events, political divides, the list goes on. To know that a child feels and thinks deeply about their world, to know that a child is listening even if he or she doesn't look like it. To know that a child can pick up on how the adults are feeling without a word being spoken. That is to have full respect for a child's mind and heart. And that's how we work at Lucy Daniel Center. So if you haven't already, I encourage you to take a moment today to really think about what does mental health actually mean to you? How would you define it? Would you define it any differently for children than for adults? How have your own experiences influenced your definition and understanding of what mental health is? And what can we together as a community do to protect our children? Thank you for this opportunity to speak about children's mental health. Please stay connected with us as we are about to open up our newest therapy wing. Uh it means we are going to add 18 new therapy offices and we can serve up to

1500 families annually. So I will be inviting you all there. Thank you everyone. [applause]

Thank you so much. Now invite the twin brothers from BNK studio.

Hello guys. Thank you, Miss Juan. Thank you, all the distinguished council members. And thank you everyone for being here today on the evening. First off, I just ask everyone to give yourself a round of applause for taking spending your time being here in such a meaningful meeting. And um as Miss Juan has already said, we started our organization obviously is for autism people, but now we want to bring more impact to the special needs as well. We started because we have a cousin who was diagnosed with autism at the age of three. And growing up it's just not not easy looking at how she's has to associate with many people who doesn't understand that vulnerability. And when we traveled here we realized we need to do something not just about her but about the whole entire community. What we have done and what we are still doing is not just about bringing changes but bring a lasting changes. Make sure people will realize is an important issue and bring awareness. And again I'm glad a lot of people are here looking re listen me saying all these. I'm obviously I'm bringing some awareness right now as I hope I am. And um yeah, I'll leave the rest to my brother. [laughter] Good evening everyone. My name is Tony Bai. I'm a high schooler from Greenh Hope High School. Currently, I'm also the co-founder and co-president of BK Studio, which is a 501c nonprofit organization. I would like to introduce you guys a little bit more about BK Studios to everyone. BK Studio is an internationalwide nonprofit organization found by me and my brother in 2023 dedicated to raise awareness for autism community and special need community. We raised more than $15,000 throughout high school mainly through sales of our

original designed art and fashion products as Miss Belon is wearing and with some raised by hosting sports tournaments and reaching out within the community. Currently, we have been working on technological programs for another massive fundrais. The patents application has been filed. To be more specific, the product the product allows artists all around the world to participate in a virtual visual reality art gallery. We will be hosting art exhibitions for artists all around the world. So, everyone is more than happy to join and we're we welcome everyone to join. Thanks.

Thank you.

[applause]

you have something last last word.

Uh sorry guys, this is going to be my last word. So obviously I respectfully ask everyone to join us on this journey too. Look, you don't have to make any sub sustained changes or any donations, volunteering, you don't have to do that. You can show kindness by daily stuff. For example, talk to them with kind languages and spend some time with them at school. Just being kind in general. You don't that's that's a part of making a change and bringing awareness.

Yeah, that's all I wanted to say. Thank you. [applause]

At this time, I'll recognize our interim town manager, Russ Overton, for his update. Mr.

Thank you. Thank you, Mayor. I wanted to take a moment and to recap for everyone the items we've been discussing this week in our two work sessions. On Tuesday, we continue talking about the FY27 budget, uh, which you, council, are set to vote on the regular meeting on June 25th. We reviewed some of the information presented earlier this month at our quarterly meeting, and we focused on potential additions uh, additional cuts council may wish uh, to make to my recommended budget. Tonight, just before this meeting, we talked about potential additional revenues the council could consider before enacting the 2027 budget

and studying during the coming year to help out our mid uh midyear or next time this year. State law requires us to have an adopted budget by June 30th. Also, from tonight's earlier work session, you received information on the proposed Austin Yard development agreement. So, I just want to highlight that. And as a reminder for everyone who missed them, the work sessions are recorded and are available on the town's YouTube channel. Our next work session, and again it's planned to be on the budget, is June 11th uh for those who may want to attend or watch online. And then finally, I want to recognize all the staff, many who aren't here tonight, uh but are working hard um and all this week and this weekend at the TST at the Wake Med Park. And I hope many of you uh plan to attend, including council. Um, just a quick shout out because it hit me that um with Michelle, Council Member Craig being a school teacher, uh, school teachers uh, uh, teach kids and uh, so this is a shout out to my two kids that are graduating uh, this Saturday. Uh, also twins

a

Yep. that um will graduate this weekend and uh, look forward to that. So hopefully they're at home watching. I'm sure they are. And then just [laughter] congratulations to all the high schoolers that will be graduating over the coming weeks. And with that, I'll turn it back over to you, Mayor.

Thank you, Mr. Overton, and congratulations on the [snorts] twins. Okay, we'll move to our third item. It's public speaks out. We've included instructions for speaking this at this forum, online, and on the printed agenda. There were three opportunities to participate in public speaks out through written comments by calling in or by attending here in person this evening. And if you are here in person and would like to speak at public speaks out, I would ask that you take a seat in the rows to my right that are now highlighted. Public speaks out speakers have up to three minutes each for their comments

and may speak on any town related topic as long as it's not a public hearing. And that's to your advantage because you get more time to speak at a public hearing. The threeminut time limit will be enforced, not to be rude, but to be fair to all of our speakers. We have a timer on the podium. It will start off with a green light. When it turns yellow, that means you have 30 seconds remaining. And when it starts flashing red, your time is expired. And if that is the point, I will interrupt you. Again, not trying to be rude, but trying to be fair to all of our speakers. I would ask our speakers to be respectful in their comments and direct those comments to the entire council and not to an individual. I thank everyone in the audience for understanding and respecting that this is a business meeting. Please do not applaud, make remarks from your seats, use props, or do anything that may distract from this meeting. So, now is the time for public speaks out. And first, I'm going to call on the clerk for any written comments and to call on any registered speakers.

We had two written comments. They have been emailed to council prior to the meeting, provided to council upon arrival, and attached to the online agenda. We have seven registered speakers, all in person, and no virtual call-ins. So, our first speaker is Jamie Swizzler. Thanks. Good evening, mayor, members of council. I'm Jamie Schadler, 301 Fateville Street with Parker Poe, here on behalf of the applicant for the 701 Weston Parkway resoning that we've had so much discussion about. I'd like to take a few words tonight and then go

through the master plan uh to explain a few changes that we've made and appreciate all the feedback that we've received so far. We stood here before you nine months ago with a completely different plan. One that raised questions about the intensity of the use, the separation from our neighbors, and what transitions should look like. You asked us to give more certainty about where the buildings could go. And the neighbors asked us to provide more separation because of their concerns about noise and the proximity of the buildings to their homes. The aging office buildings on site are not the future of Kerry. they won't be able to continue in this form and they must redevelop. This proposal thoughtfully swaps that vacant office for something people moving to Kerry need homes. It's tempting to think that a less intense use will come where a different buyer would come with another use perhaps town homes. But the reality is the price of land in Kerry is increasing and the need to house more people is not going down. for this site. There is not a better proposal that houses people while providing real solutions to the problems that have been brought to us over the past two years in dealing with this case. The neighbors brought real concerns and to deliver the neighbors the certainty that they asked for nine months ago and the certainty that this council requested. Please approve this case tonight. Don't gamble on the idea of a lesser intense use or some proposal that's not in front of you when you have the sure thing right in front of you with trusted partners who have taken the time to make their promises into real commitments in a detailed PDD that's before you tonight. And that PDD has several important changes since the public hearing to address concerns on intensity. We've reduced the density from uh 275 units. We've reduced the height to 75 ft. We've required uh the majority of our 3,000 square feet of community gathering area to be inside the building so that we can place those amenities in a courtyard and prevent that noise from spilling out, those lights from spilling out to respond to

those neighbors concerns. To address separation, we've pushed the building back much further than what it was before you at the initial public hearing. Our master plan now requires this building envelope to be within 400 ft of a semicircle of the intersection. It pushes the footprint to approximately where that building is today. And then it also allows for only a very small portion of the building to be in this purple area if we're able to get relief from that spine road. And we push the building another 25 ft back um from our closest neighbor, Chad Bowers. And Chad's house, even if you're standing in the background uh backyard with the separation, you'd be a football field away from the closest point of that that building. The rest of his neighbors with the separation from the HOA and the buffer would be almost two football fields. the transition was made more impactful and we request approval tonight. Please approve the sure thing of 275 new workers in this employment area. Thank you.

Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Zach Evans. [clears throat] Good evening, mayor and members of council. My name is Zach Evans with Kain Realy and I'm here as the development representative for 701 Weston Parkway. For decades, Kain Realy has been a leader in the development and management of district level spaces in the triangle through the employment of smart growth principles. Our goal is to create spaces that improve the quality of life of residents, neighbors, businesses, and visitors. We pride ourselves on taking a community approach to creating great spaces, and our designs are rooted in the cities and neighborhoods we love. As local developers, our reputation means everything. We seek to build long-term relationships with all our stakeholders, including neighbors, land owners, and municipalities alike. This resoning represents Kainy's first residential project in Kerry. And we don't take that lightly. We want to earn the right to be a long-term partner here. And the way we do that is by

listening to staff, to neighbors, and to council and by delivering something that we're proud to stake our reputation on for the next 30 years. That's what we've tried to do at 7001 Weston Parkway. We came to the table with a trusted partner in Highwoods, listened to the community through multiple rounds of feedback, and revised the plan meaningfully each time. The project before you tonight is better because of that process. There's two changes in particular from the original application that I want to call out specifically. First is building design. The multif family buildings must now be built within a well- definfined envelope in the northeast corner of the site, roughly where the existing buildings sit today. This allows us to save much of the existing parking and the mature trees, which is something we are very proud of. We've also committed to groundf flooror retail space to provide new food and retail options for workers and residents along the western corridor. The heartbeat of our developments is the ground floor experience and we go to great lengths to find the right operators to fill these commercial spaces that ultimately serve the surrounding community. In addition, the PDD includes architectural commitments that increase masonry requirements on facades, prohibits vinyl and concrete block, and requires variations in roof lines, which is consistent with the high quality buildings both Cane and Highwoods are known for. And secondly, transitions. Instead of a sixoot fence at the southern property line, the plan now includes a much denser planting of 25 evergreen plants per 100 linear feet positioned at a higher elevation to provide more effective natural screening between the new buildings and neighboring homes. This evergreen screen is in addition to the 30 to 45 ft type A perimeter buffer along the majority of the southern property line. Lastly, no accessory building buildings will be permitted between the southern perimeter buffers and primary building envelope reducing potential impacts on neighbors with regard to noise and vis

visibility. This was done to address neighbor concerns raised at the public hearing. And in conclusion, we are grateful to for the productive collaboration we've shared with neighbors, staff, and council throughout this process. We're excited with the opportunity to partner with Highwoods in the future of the Western Parkway corridor. Our next register speaker is Skip Hill.

Mayor, members of council, thank you for the time to listen to me to tonight. Um, my name is Skip Hill. I'm the senior vice president and market leader for company called Highwoods Properties who has been in Kerry for over 30 years uh out at Weston. and we've enjoyed such a great relationship with the community, not only the neighbors, but the town, the staff, and we appreciate the uh opportunity to have have served out at Weston for so many years. I've had the pleasure of being the division head here for 20 years. So, uh I understand Weston, I understand the neighbors, and we've had such a great relationship with the neighbors. I appreciate all the time and effort and input that you guys, the neighbors, Kain Realy have put into this project. It is a really good project. We have developments all over the country and this is one of the best uh projects we have out at Weston. We own about a million and a half square feet of development out there and we hope to be here for another 30 years. We're we are grounded here and we are not going to do anything that will u do anything to deter and make uh west any worse than it is. It's a great development out there. So, thank you for your time and I'm really really appreciative of Kain and all the work they have done to listen to what you guys have said and to to modify the development to where it is today. It's a great development. Thank you.

Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Joe Ma Mazi. Laza.

Laza. Sorry, [laughter]

we know Joe.

Yes, we know Joe.

Hey, uh Joe Malazo, resident of the Northern Kerry area. I have two thank yous this evening. U both related to walkability in the North Kerry area. First, I want to thank the council and the town professional staff for the new Kerry Parkway pedestrian bridge. Uh the section over Black Creek was the final place along the entirety of our town's namesake street without a sidewalk on at least one side. That bridge is now open. It allows the apartments west of Black Creek to access North Kerry Park and to do so safely, and that is beautiful. So, I want to thank you for that. My second thank you is to the council, the planning staff, the developers, and the neighbors. So for the work associated with the resoning case 24-14, which is on your agenda this evening. I want to thank first of all the planning staff for encouraging the incorporation of commercial space. I want to thank you to the developers for ensuring that the space will be retail of walkable use. I want to thank you the neighbors for providing the input and perspective to make this proposed development better. I'm going to focus my remarks for the prop for the remainder of my remarks on walkability, accessibility, and certainty. If we're serious about walkability, we need to be able to walk to something. Right now, the total number of retail places anyone can easily walk to in a reasonable distance from the subdivisions in the Norwell Boulevard Central Weston area is zero. That would become a positive number if this proposal moves forward. Legitimate concerns for any development involve traffic, involve noise, distance, screening, compatibility. This is where certainty comes in, which is possible with the resoning with conditions versus by right. Here's my understanding of those issues. Uh the peak period evening traffic, which is what most of us think of when we think of traffic, would be significantly lower than what a full lease out of the

existing building is today, let alone what they could do by right. The daily traffic will be higher than today. But that office building is empty today. While the future traffic will be higher, it will be no different than what the developer would be allowed to do now by right if they redevelop it more intensely. Noise is always a legitimate concern. Placing more than 90% of the shared amendy space within the center courtyard box is obviously helpful. Keeping the building uh on the northeast corner keeps it more prominent for the redevelopment, which is good. It shows that Weston's moving forward, and it also keeps it further away from the single family homes, which is good. The fact that the nearest building face to an existing home will be more than two times the distance that it could otherwise be by right is excellent. That's 268 ft versus 133. Finally, the one thing any resoning gets you is control. Some assurance of what will be there and more importantly what will not be. What's better than trust? Development conditions. So this development creates that opportunity for control for uh screening buffers evergreen and so on. The residential element creates the opportunity for rooftops and for retail to work. Retail creates a sense of place and the walkability as well. I'm not speaking for another group other than those who have waited a long time to be able to walk to something. Thank you very much.

Thank you. Our next speaker is Katherine Morris. Good evening, mayor and town council, and thank you for listening me to me this evening. My name is Katherine Morris and I came to talk about the resoning of 26-REZ-6 which is Regency Park and it's PDD amendment Regency Woods. Um, the proposal is a development in Regency Woods and it would ruin

everything about the neighborhood that I came to love and that is why I moved there. Um, it would increase noise pollution, it would increase air pollution, and it would increase traffic. And I'm not just speaking for myself here. I'm speaking for hundreds of neighbors and also the people in the environment around my neighborhood. I love my neighborhood. I would like to keep it that way. Um, it's a great part of the town of Kerry and why should we ruin it with another reszoning of another part? And last but not least, it would also decrease the value of all the homes in the area. So, thank you very much. And um I realized this I this is new and I just learned about this when I was out of the country but I really feel strongly about it and I wanted to bring it to your attention now. Thank you.

Thank you. Our next treasure speaker is Chin Feay. Good evening, members of the council and members of the audience. My name is Cheng Feang. I'm here today to ask the council to consider a housing bond referendum that matches the funding allocated in the 2023 referendum, which would expand the housing budget for the 2027 fiscal year. Recently, the town of Kerry has passed a $5.3 million housing initiative that aims to construct

additional affordable housing units, preserve homes in low-income areas, and provide homelessness and emergency services. I thank the council for the great strides the town of Kerry has made in affordable housing. However, as housing prices increased, our commitment to ensuring affordable housing for all of Kerry residents must continue. Housing prices both locally and nationally have been increasing exponentially. Housing downtown has been valued at over $1 million and continue to rise as the triangle population expands. The increased demand for affordable housing alongside rising housing cost make the younger generation such as myself wonder whether they will be able to afford to live in Kerry. Having lived in Kerry my whole life, I hope that I can continue to live in this town as an adult. But the sharp increases in housing prices is deeply concerning to me and to many other residents. I also want to share the opportunities I had in this town with my future children who require stable and affordable housing. Stable housing helps students succeed academically, socially, and emotionally. Investing in housing stability strengthens the entire community. According to the North Carolina Housing Finance Agency, stable housing is linked to higher educational achievements, school attendance, and lower incarceration rates. By allocating funds to promote stable housing, children in the town of Kerry will have an equal access to well-funded schools. I specifically ask that the town of Kerry used the portion of the 2027 fiscal housing budget to fund dense housing units. According to UNCC Chapel Hill, 72% of low-income North Carolinians spend over 50% of their income on housing while also having to deal with an extremely competitive market. Due to low supply of houses, many potential buyers place inflated bids on housing to be competitive. Low and middle inome households cannot compete with these high bids. This means they are pushed out of the market, making it harder for residents to buy houses in the future. By funding denser housing units and mixed development, we

can continue to build more housing units and smaller plots of land. This would create less competition, which would turn support middle and low-income residents. The town of Kerry must address the issue of rising cost in housing by considering a housing res referendum and an increase in the overall 2027 fiscal year housing budget. I believe that the town of Kerry will be able to create create a community where children can thrive and promote a sustainable and equitable future for all. Thank you so much for your time.

Thank you.

Our last register speaker is Matthew Cordon. Hello ladies and gentlemen, the esteemed members of the council, town manager, mayor. Um, I will start by apologizing. I did not prepare a written script that would hold me to the level of professionalism. I was very astonished and and uh appreciative of the people who came before me in speaking. I uh had to come here at last moment. I was very busy as a candidate for NCGA um preparing my candidacy to be the best of it can be for the good of everyone here and those who are not in attendance. Now I came to speak about uh 5.2 into, but I will pivot in good humor. Um, as a pair of two have had a misunderstanding or perhaps there was a mistake there in the topic that I spoke to them on the phone about how I was going to be speaking on that subject.

If you'd like to wait for the budget, you get five minutes.

Sure.

And we'll call you back up for the

We'll call you back if you want to speak about the budget.

I'd be happy to. Thank you very much.

Okay. Thank you. That's the last of the registered speakers.

Yes. If you're here in the audience and

would like to speak on any topic that is not a public hearing, now is your opportunity. Hey, how are you? My name is Bryson Johnson. I'm a state house candidate in district 21 representing Kerry and Apex. I've uh been either a residential uh homeowner in Kerry or a commercial um taxpayer in this district for over 20 years. Right now, I live in Apex. First, I want to just take, you know, a moment to acknowledge everyone's public service. You know, choosing to be a public servant is not easy. Um because every action that you take is scrutinized. and I appreciate uh all of your service. You know, I think we get involved in politics with uh with good intentions. That said, uh we also have to be honest about what's happening in local government today. James Madison warned about factionalism. That's a fancy word for today would be called an echo chamber. And he warned about it in Federalist number 10. He was trying to earn adoption of the or wide acceptance of the constitution. And that's the danger of government becoming dominated by a single way of thinking. Other than having healthy debate, of opposing ideas, we enter echo chambers. That's what I'm witnessing here today. There's very little diversity of thought represented here or we would not be spending taxpayer dollars on projects like flash mob videos. Now I you know I could have provided you with someone who could have given you some insight on that. I don't know who had approved that but if you

had asked me I said well maybe that's better use of our dollars spent on actual people other than flash mob videos. But there's very little for diversity of thought and that's what happens. Uh, also we spent several hundred,000 on documentary videos which may get a few hundred views. And lastly, we paid for a master's degree playing favoritism while neglecting everyone else. You know, I I could have been that guy to say, you know, I don't know that's a that's a great idea. Where where was that? Did no one say that was a bad idea with the flash mob video? Did nobody say that was a bad idea? And that's because we have factionalism, echo chambers. And that's what I'm asking you for more diversity of thought. We need more healthy disagreement. And that's it. I mean, I've known were for a long time. Good guy. But um 20 years ago you were at our grand opening if you remember that. Um it's been here a long time. You know Kerry is a great place to live. Let's keep it that way. But we cannot get involved in echo chambers. It's the factionalism that James Madison warned us about. Thanks.

Thank you.

Next speaker, please. Good evening, Mr. Mayor and the council. My name is David Litchfield. I live in Carolina [clears throat and snorts] Preserve. About 10 days ago, Mrs. Bonsil and the chief of police met with us to discuss an emerging problem here that cities all over America and the world face, and that is the uh issue and the use of electric bikes. We've had a lot of close calls. We've had citizens in our neighborhoods, people our age, walk.

We get out on the sidewalks. We're very active. We have these young teenagers operating these machines with very little supervision. I've reviewed the current ordinance and I understand that you all are now working to update the ordinance on electric bikes. I just ask that you put a lot of good uh effort into this. Get some smart lawyers to review what you're going to put out. If one little 85year-old woman in my neighborhood gets knocked over and killed by one of these electric bikes, uh, the family could sue the city for millions of dollars. You don't want that to happen. We also generally don't want the children to be hurt either. Right now, there's no record of how many bikes are operating here, the models, whether they're class one, two, or three. I can, although the North Carolina rules say the motor should not exceed 750 watts, I can go to Bosch and Kinston and Newburn where I used to live and I can buy a,200 watt motor and stick it on my bike and I can get that bike up to 50 miles an hour. And if I'm 175B teenager riding a 70 lb bike going 40 miles an hour on the sidewalk and you get hit, we don't want that to happen. So, work with the chief. Have your lawyers review this thing. Make sure it's a good, tight ordinance. U I was very impressed with the chief and his staff. We have a great police department here. And I want to thank you all for operating a wonderful city. This is a wonderful place to live. We want to keep it that way. Give the chief his 60 plus new officers he's asking for. They'll help with the problem. So, please support that. continue to support working with ICE to keep criminals out of the city. And once again, I want to thank you for the time. It's been a privilege to talk to you tonight. We don't want anybody to get

hurt. So, let's come up with a good strict ordinance. There are many things you can do. Number one, you can send police officers into the middle and high schools once a year and make a presentation on the rules. You can consider requiring insurance for these bikes. You can consider registering these bikes. 55 years ago, when I came back from Vietnam, having survived my year, and I was stationed in San Diego, I bought a 10-speed bike. The city of San Diego slapped an ID tag on that bike and registered it. Every bike in that city was registered. We should have something like that here,

Mr. Lichfield.

So, once again, thank you.

Thank you. Next speaker, please. bit too high for me. Okay. Good evening, council members. Um, I hope you're doing well today. My name is Jennica Inigo and I am the co-president of the Green Level High School Heart Club and American Heart Association chapter. I am here to discuss the updates to carry smoking ordinances as proposed by the American Heart Association. Before I begin, I just want to tell a little of a story. I recently went on a school trip for a competition. It was just two days long, you know, a short time away from home, away from parents, no expectations. A fellow student of mine got caught vaping in the hotel bathroom and was sent home. When they asked them, they explained that they couldn't stand not having their vape and being a not being able to smoke even for those two days. As a student in high school, they were so reliant on the vape that they ruined their chances of competing and part of their reputation with teachers, an opportunity that was close to them because of this tobacco because of vaping. I would like to emphasize the importance of updating these smoke-free ordinances in order to set clear restrictions on vaping and prevent smoking behaviors in younger individuals. Within North

Carolina alone, about 15,800 students try a cigarette each year, often pushed by peer pressure and a desire to be cool. With smoking and vaping taking places, even places where it is banned, like my school bathrooms, all due respect, it's not cool to have a higher risk for pulmonary disease to develop lung cancer. And it's not cool that about onethird of these students will endure long-standing addictions to tobacco and potentially die in the future. Updating these ordinances will establish clear norms and discourage smoking behavior in countless students, bettering their health and beginning to get rid of this terrible trend. Smoking and vaping restrictions in public places will be stricter, reducing the possibility of secondhand smoke and preventing exposure to these toxic substances to others. Your support of these ordinances and updating them based on the verbiage provided by the AHA will work in further reinforcing community initiatives and healthy messages towards kids and individuals of all ages, promoting a healthy lifestyle, a fact that is becoming incredibly crucial as our country begins to enter a public health crisis. Thank you for your time.

Thank you. Next speaker, please. Good evening, representatives. I hope you're doing well. My name is Peramin Nakshi and I'm a member of the Green Level High School Heart Club and American Heart Association chapter. My co-president Jennica just spoke about the benefits to our youth about updating these ordinances and what that benefit will provide. I'd also like to mention the economic details of updating our smoking ordinances. Currently, NC tobacco companies spend around $429.6 million a year on marketing, while the state spends around half a million a year on tobacco prevention, which is only 3% 3% of the total funds allocated by the state for tobacco prevention itself. As a student who has seen my peers fall victim to the marketing of these companies, I firmly

believe that we should use more, if not all, of the funds allocated for tobacco varention and secondhand smoke exposure prevention for that purpose. Not only will this reduce the effectiveness of marketing companies, but it will also push for healthier practices that in turn reduce the amount of health care costs for individuals annually on the local and state level. As a student, I see how smoking and vaping don't just affect health, they affect finances, too. The cost of doctor visits, medications, and treatment add up quickly. These expenses place a burden on families long after the initial decision of choosing to use tobacco. Prevention is far less costly than treatment. Using these funds and updating these ordinances is an active step towards the health of the local community, but also for the betterment of high school students like me. Thank you.

Thank you. Next speaker, please. Anyone else for public speaks out? Seeing no one, I'll close public speaks out. We will now move to the consent agenda portion of the meeting. For benefit of those people watching our meeting uh streaming, YouTube, wherever, I'll take a moment to review our consent agenda items. Please keep in mind that one vote approves all of these items. On the consent agenda, we have minutes. Conveyance of surplus information technology equipment. disposal of surplus personal property $30,000 or more and 259 annexation of Jacob's Creek. Would council members like any of these items pulled for discussion? If not, I would entertain a motion to approve the consent agenda.

So moved.

There's a motion, second, and a second. Discussion. All in favor, please say I. I.

Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously.

We now move to public hearing. Before the presentation, I'll recognize town attorney Lisa Glover for remarks. Thank you, mayor. Um, as all of you on the council know, my mother moved to Sears Stone last fall. And while there's no legal conflict of interest for me to set up here tonight with you while you have the public hearing, I thought in the interest of transparency and to avoid any appearance of a conflict, I'm going to step down for the public hearing. and your deputy town attorney, Matt Pence, is going to um take my seat for this hearing and then I'll be back after that.

Thank you.

Welcome.

For this public hearing, planning manager Aaron Pucket will introduce the item. Council will not take action on this resoning tonight, but it will be referred to our planning and zoning advisory board. The item will return to council at a future meeting, more likely several months. Miss Pucket.

Thank you, mayor, and good evening, council. This is a request to reszone approximately 17.44 acres at 1601 High House Road and 12590 Winston Hill Drive. The site is located on the south side of High House Road, east of its intersection with Davis Drive. The Searsstone retirement community is located to the south of the site and the Preston Forest neighborhood is located to the east. Car's GIS indicates a possible stream buffer impacting large portions of the site. Field determination of such features is required at time of development plan review. Parks, Recreation, and Cultural Resources Master Plan indicates a greenway corridor along the eastern boundary of the site and streetside trail along the site frontage on High House Road. High House Road is a thoroughfare on K's planned roadways map and go Carry Route 4 currently operates

along this section of High House Road. The site is currently zoned planned development district major or PDD major and it is located in the Searsstone PDD. For some additional background, the 77 acre Searsstone PDD was originally approved in 2002 as the Sears Farm PD. The PDD at that time proposed a continuing care retirement community or CCRC, a type of residential development aimed at seniors, which typically provides a suite of full life care options from independent living to assisted living to skilled nursing care. The PDD also included a commercial village intended to offer walkable retail options. At the time the PDD was initially approved, the subject site, which is outlined in yellow here, was entitled primarily for detached dwellings along with one multif family building. The PDD has been amended several times since its initial approval and was eventually renamed Searstone during that process. The most recent PDD amendment directly impacting the subject site was a 2015 resoning which entitled the northeastern portion of the assemblage for age restricted multif family and duplex units or what the Searsstone PDD refers to as cluster units with the southern portion of the subject site retaining its multif family and cluster unit entitlement. That amendment also established a remaining residential entitlement for the entire Searsstone CCRC of 83 units. The proposed resoning would retain the zoning of PDD major and change the entitlement for the subject portion of the PDD. As the site [snorts] is also located in the mixeduse overlay district, the PDD amendment includes a preliminary development plan or PDP. Proposed development standards include a maximum of 87 town houses. This would be approximately five units per acre. A maximum height of 42 feet. Architectural requirements for the town

houses, including a two-car garage for each unit, pitched roofs, and varied roof lines for each town home building, a commitment to a minimum percentage of masonry material on each facade, and no vinyl sighting, as well as sustainability requirements for the units, including a residential energy services network home energy rating service or HERS score of 45 or better, which is indicative of a high level of efficiency. Solar conduit to allow the possibility of future solar panels and wiring for future electric vehicle charging is also proposed. The proposal includes at least 41,000 square ft of community gathering space with a pick list of amenities which exceeds the LDO requirement for gathering space. The general location of these areas is represented by the blue stars shown on this slide. A 30-foot type A streetscape is proposed along High House Road. This is consistent with that of the original Searsstone PDD approval, but less than the 50-foot streetscape that the LDO would otherwise require today for townous. A 15-oot type B streetscape is offered along several of the internal streets, including portions of Winston Hill Drive, Walkerstone Drive, and Lily Ridge Road. A segment of greenway is provided to connect to the existing greenway network. The exact length and location of that connection will be determined at time of development plan. A 12- foot wide streetside trail is offered along the site's high house road frontage, which is a slight increase to the 10- foot wide streetside trail required today, but consistent with the forthcoming move and engage chapter updates. And in addition, 10- foot wide side paths are offered internally along Walkerstone and Winston Hill Drive to help enhance connectivity in the development with a caveat that a portion of the Winston Hill Drive side path will rely on the developer obtaining approval from an adjacent property owner and thus is not guaranteed.

The proposal also offers to complete an off-site portion of side path along High House Road. Given the limited width available in existing rightway, an 8 foot wide facility is offered with the ability to narrow to six feet wide as needed. Multimmodal improvements also include high visibility crosswalks at multiple locations in the immediate area, including High House Road and Davis Drive, Davis Drive and Sarth Lane, Davis Drive and Searsstone Drive, High House Road at Lily Ridge Road, the newly created intersection at High House Road and Walkerstone Drive, and internal crosswalks at the roundabout at Lily Ridge and Winston Hill Drive. The locations labeled in gray here are subject to additional approvals or easements from other parties for all or a portion of those improvements and therefore are not guaranteed. Improvements at the High House intersections at Davis Drive and Lily Ridge Road will also include changing those signals to include a leading pedestrian interval or LPI, which allows pedestrians to begin crossing in advance of the vehicular green light. A preliminary analysis against the imaginary community plan found that policies in the live, work, shape, move, and enrich chapters apply. Town houses currently make up only a small percentage of the housing within the surrounding commercial mixeduse center. So the proposal could contribute to housing choice in the immediate area. This may also help address the associated work policy regarding diverse needs of K's workforce. However, live policies also cite the importance of providing senior housing for car's aging population and the proposal removes the existing entitlement for age restricted retirement community units and currently proposes no age or income restrictions. The proposal develops most of the remaining undeveloped portion of the Sears Stone development which could address the goal of residential infill.

Regarding shape, the proposal seeks to develop an infill site with a reasonable residential transition to nearby uses. A 40 foot a 42 foot height limit would further help with transitions by keeping the overall building heights somewhat consistent with those of nearby three-story buildings. Regarding the appearance and quality of development, the proposal commits to large amounts of gathering space with amenities. Architectural commitments are also provided but do not explicitly speak to a cohesive appearance with existing development in Searsstone. Further, the proposal expands a dry pond shown on previous development plans, a storm water control measure or SCM, which does not meet the aesthetic requirements of K's current LDO due to the lack of plantings for such a device. However, all of K's and the state's current storm water management regulations would still apply at time of development plan. The proposal makes a number of commitments to multimmoal infrastructure, including wider bicycle and pedestrian facilities along the site frontage and within the development and an off-site improvement to widen existing sidewalk between the site and Davis Drive to an 8 foot wide side path to help connect multimmoal facilities in the area. A number of high visibility crosswalks will also be provided internal and external to the site. Although several of those crosswalks along with a portion of that internal side path are subject to easements or approvals granted by others and are not guaranteed. But overall the proposal does appear to address multiple move chapter policies. The proposal keeps the reduced high house road streetscape previously granted with the original Sears Stone approval, which could result in less tree preservation than would otherwise be required per the LDO today. Modest interior streetscapes will add some trees internally, while expansion of a um excuse me, of a dry pond and the associated easement could result in the removal of additional trees. Policies related to tree and open space preservation may therefore only be partially met. The applicant has offered

to make home solar and electric vehicle charging ready and to achieve a high energy efficiency score. All of which can promote energy efficiency and sustainable energy practices. Town houses can be supported as an incidental use and commercial mixeduse centers. These areas also recommend well-defined vehicular and pedestrian networks, improved multimmoal infrastructure, and active public spaces. The proposal provides amenitized gathering space and widens existing and proposed bicycle and pedestrian facilities. A neighborhood meeting was held in March of 2024 and five members of the public participated. Questions and concerns were primarily around the use of town houses and their potential height and concerns about drainage impacts. Staff has periodically received inquiries about the request in the two years since that neighborhood meeting with most of those contacts seeking general updates on the project and schedule. Staff mailed notification of the public hearing to property owners within 800 ft of the subject site which exceeds the states and carries LDO requirements and signs were posted on the subject property. This concludes my presentation. Call your marsh. The applicant's representative is here to speak and following the public hearing I'm available for questions.

Thank you. [clears throat and cough] Good evening, Mayor Weinre, Mayor Prom, members of council. I'm call your marsh with Parker Poe at 301 Fateville Street, but more importantly on Springbud Drive here in Kerry just down the road about halfway between here and the site we're talking about today. I'm here on behalf of the applicant which is Edinburg Development. Um Edinburg Development is a Kerrybased developer uh with Jim McMillan, Ed Rap, and Jay Rap as the principles. Um Jim's a lifelong Kerry resident and Ed and Jay have spent a couple of tours here uh but have been longtime residents as well. The name in fact uh is after Edinburg Drive where

Jay and Ed live, where Jim's parents live, and where Jim grew up. So um we have a lot of strong ties to Carrie. And this site is especially important to our team uh being so close to us. We want to make sure we get it right. Um so this is part of the overall Sears uh farm PDD. Uh the town has a long history with this corner. Uh it was originally entitled all the way back in 2002. It's a 77 acre development and as the town has observed uh there is an original grand vision for the Sears Farm PD that has evolved quite a bit over time and there are a lot of stories that many of us can tell about what occurred there. Uh but needless to say the site was broken up over time. Uh pieces were sold off for various reasons. The original vision wasn't exactly fulfilled but new projects came and met an overall new vision for the site. And so we're part of that new vision to conform with today's comprehensive plan for this corner. Um Edinburg Edinberg's involvement with the site started in 2019 uh when they first uh went under contract for the site and they acquired it specifically for the purpose to develop exactly what's entitled there today. So we have the Searsstone uh retirement care facility there and the site is currently entitled for CCRC units and Edinburgh's intent was just to develop CCRC units as approved by this town. Um and they spent uh extensive efforts to fulfill that goal, fulfill that vision. Spent over a year with frequent um open houses once a month at the Prestonwood Country Club to gauge interest on the project to develop it exactly as approved by the town. Um over the course of that more than a year's time period, they generated little interest, not enough to actually be able to finance and kick off the project. And one of the things they heard was that the price of these units was just too high. These units were specifically designed as part of the original project, but over time the market didn't line up with that vision. Um, this was complicated in 2020 with COVID. We all know a lot of things happened with COVID, but one of the things particular to this project is major price in increases across the board throughout the country for any

number of things. So Edinburg was faced with a project that was already too expensive for the market and then with rising costs, they didn't have a project. So the entitlements are so specific that you have to build what was approved. They were left with no option but to reszone the property for something else if it was to be developed. Um so that's when I became involved. Um we reached out. We did not make the decision on a reasonzoning in isolation. Uh so we spoke with representatives of the town had multiple DRC meetings had communications with the Searsstone community and its ownership about what the right fit was for this site. It was clear to us at that point that going up in density really wasn't going to be supported uh in that area. Uh we knew that lower density senior housing was not financially viable and so town homes were really what everybody agreed was the appropriate route for this project. Um we heard that from town staff. We also heard it, at least we understood it from Searsstone's ownership, that it was better not to have a competing product and a new development going in that compete with Searsstone, but have something that could complement it and lead to maybe future residents living in our community and then moving over to Searstone in the future. Um, so Aaron did a great job of summarizing this project uh and went through the fine details and I just want to hit a couple of the high notes. Um, we're not asking for an increase in density. It's 87 units for 87 units. Um, these town home units are designed to a high standard, and I'll get into more of that in a moment. But some of the defining features of this project are walkability. We're on a mixeduse corner. Uh, to have successful mixeduse, you want your residents to be able to walk to the surrounding area safely. This project proposes 10-ft internal side paths, a 12-oot side path on the high house frontage. It proposes a greenway connection. Uh, and so it really increases walkability in the surrounding area. And it goes a step beyond by proposing an eight-foot side path going from the end of our property's frontage on High House all the way up to Davis Drive. So, not only can residents walk safely within our corner, but they can go safely to all four corners of this mixeduse area, High House and Davis. Um,

but when you have walkability, you want to make sure you have pedestrian safety. And uh Erin had a great slide showing all the different areas where we're adding high visibility crosswalks and pedestrian improvements. By my count, 10 of those will be added by this developer with this project to improve safety for intersections that already exist today. Um, beyond that, open space is a defining feature of the site over 41,000 square feet. I'll talk about the placement that of that more in a moment, but it's placed in areas to benefit the surrounding community as much as possible. Um, architecture is designed to exceed uh CAM standards with over 11 commitments. And then I think the most defining feature of this project is the environmental sustainability uh commitments that we have. So when we realized that the [snorts] vision for this corner had changed over time, we wanted to create a new component of this project that makes it exciting and offers something new. And so these homes are going to be designed and our conditions and shore uh to be what's essentially called zero ready homes. So, they're designed and built to such a high efficient standard that when connected to a renewable energy source such as solar, they don't need outside power to power them. They essentially supply their own power. Um, and so we have those standards for the construction so that we're efficient. We have solar conduits so that when residents move in, they can then install the solar and get their own tax benefits for it. And then we also have um EV charging for these homes as well. We wanted to set a high bar and a new kind a new standard for environmentally sustainable development. Um but again we didn't make these decisions in isolation. This project responds to any number of stakeholders feedback throughout the process. Uh we've worked extensively with the town for more than four years on this project. Like I said, we started in 2021 and we've had a number of meetings through DRC and then five formal submitts for this project to make sure that we got it right. Uh we've made extensive changes based on staff feedback related to layout, materials, open space, pedestrian connections, you name it. We've made fine-tune adjustments to uh check off every box we're able to. Um but we've also worked with the Searsstone community and I

appreciate that we have uh several members of the Searsstone community here tonight. We appreciate their involvement and understand how important it is to that community to make sure that we get this project right. Um beyond that original neighborhood meeting, we met with various rep representatives of Searsstone, including they had their own resident development committee that met with us. Um but between various members of that um organization over 10 times um and we heard a number of concerns and questions about the project and through those communications we made a number of changes already to this project. Um those changes include moving open space in our site. And so when you think about mixed use in the community plan development, we have open space. Think about centrally located open space. And when we first looked at this project, it was central to our section. But in speaking with the neighbors, we learned that it needed to be central to the overall community. So we took uh a segment of town homes, five homes that would have been on that lakefront where the star is, remove those, and replace that with an open space that can be a benefit to the broader community. So, a major shift in our project's layout to address their concerns. We also ensured high quality architecture to make sure it's compatible and worked a number of street realignments and uh unit locations based on the feedback we heard from them. Um, so this project is consistent with the Kerry community plan. It's consistent with the future growth framework designation. We're in a commercial center mixeduse corner here and what that talks about is having a diverse uh range of housing options walkable to your retail. And so we're adding that housing diversity and we're also adding that walkability that's absent in a lot of this corner today. Um we're also consistent with a number of policies and I appreciate the staff's presentation highlighting uh any number of them that were consistent with but two that stand out to me are in the live chapter. Policy two says provide more housing choices for all residents. And so when we say all residents it means we want to accommodate a variety of lifestyles, households, ages, cultures, market preferences, and incomes. We want diversity of housing options. We don't want to isolate any one community in one

area. We want everybody to be living together and this project accomplishes that. And then that leads to policy four which says provide the greatest variety of housing options in mixed use centers. In this corner, it's not the strongest of mixed use centers in in the town. That corner compared to just the other three at that same intersection is struggling. We are adding that variety of housing options within this corner to make it more successful. And we've heard from the shop owners and the business owners that they're excited about having a mix of housing in this corner. So in conclusion, this is a project that is led by a Kerrybased developer that cares a lot about this town, a lifelong resident that's that's leading the project. This project will help to revitalize this mixeduse corner at High House in Davis Drive. And the project strikes the right balance here uh addressing a number of competing factors from staff and communities uh view on the site by providing diversified housing options all while delivering a highquality neighborhood that sets a high bar for sustainable development. So with that uh we have our team here. We're happy to answer any questions that you may have. Thank you.

Thank you. [clears throat]

So now it's time for the public hearing for 240 sear stone PDD amendment. And I'll call on the clerk for written comments and any registered speakers.

We had 10 written comments and eight registered speakers. Those comments have been emailed to council prior to the meeting, provided to council upon arrival, and attached to the online agenda. Our first inerson speaker is Susan Brunson. Good evening, Mayor Weinre, council members, and staff. I'm Susan Brunson. I

reside at 19001 Searsstone Drive. I moved to Kerry in 2021 and I have been at Searsstone for two years now. I am the current president of the Searsstone residents association. As such, I represent 500 plus residents and the interests of over 350 on our growing weight list. Many Searsstone residents are here tonight while many more are watching this live stream with great interest. They strongly oppose this resoning application. Searstone attracts a very diverse population. We come here from all over the country and other nations. We are a close-knit community. The very heart of our community is the lake. Directly jeopardized by the current proposals for development on lot 41. I chose Sears Stone largely because of the type of residents who live there and also the quiet, serene, wideopen, green campus. That serenity is part of what we stand to lose if the current application is approved. Searsstone is a very desirable community. It's a continuing care retirement community or CCRC. Like other CCRC's, it offers a lifetime contract that provides seniors with social interaction, emotional support, and a continuum of both care for a living and health care in one safe, comfortable, fiscally secure community where everybody knows your name. It is no secret that the 65 plus demographic is rapidly expanding, expected to surpass 21% in Wake County by 2050. Simultaneously, overall population growth will severely challenge housing supply in the next 10 to 15 years.

A substantial portion of this challenge will include demand from senior adults seeking service enriched housing options. CCRC's address this need. They reduce pressure on traditional housing stock by right-sizing older adults, by providing care that can lower burdens on public health care and long-term care, by generating stable employment, and by anchoring economies through consistent spending and investment. Land already allocated to CCRC expansion should not be reduced. Carrie approved the Sears farm plan development district some 24 years ago as a master plan community with a CCRC at its core surrounding parcels chosen to complement senior living controlled traffic access a unified architectural style and long-term predictability. Searsstone is the result of these considerable efforts. residents moved here and invested here because the PDD promised stability and stewardship of both people and place. Current application seeks complete release from this long-standing plan and the high standards that you approved for this year's farm PDD. This represents a fundamental philosophical shift in land use intent. It is not a minor adjustment. Searstone residents have followed this proposed development since early in 2024. We have met with the applicants to no avail. At the beginning of this year, we organized a group to study the current amended resoning application and to listen to our fellow residents. After much thought and preparation, we bring our concerns and a request to you.

The speakers who follow me are part of this group. They will address the historical intent of the Sears Farm PD, the growing demand for senior compatible housing, sensitivity to design, density, and site responsive concerns, the residents investmentbacked expectations, which may well be jeopardized by this resoning. We oppose the present application for resoning and request that you honor the promise of the Sears Farm PD. Thank you for your attention and consideration of our concerns.

Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Janice Matthews. I'm standing at the corner so I can see you all. Good evening. My name is Janice Matthews. My husband and I live at 805 Walkerstone Drive in Sears Stone. We moved to Sears Stone in February of 2020, February. That was about a month before the shutdown. It turned out it was a great place to be at that time because of all the care and support that we got at Sears Stone. Along with most of my fellow residents, we view Searsstone as our forever home. My goal this evening is to give a brief review of the history of the Sears Farm Planned Development District, PDD, and how it shaped our community. The original Sears Farm PD was approved by Carrie in 2002. The stated purpose in the master plan was to serve K's growing senior adult community. The PDD was approved as a unified intentional plan, not a collection of unrelated parcels. It was anchored by a continuing care retirement community, a CCRC that got named Searsstone. The plan

had killer rules, meaningful open space, setbacks from the lake, respect for steam for steam streams and flood planes, quality architecture, and development that fits the land rather than overwhelms it. Those rules came with conditions. Limits on where residential units could be placed on the property, facilities that had to be operational before residents could move in, strict protections for flood plane and stream corridors, and roads that had to be completed before occupancy. All these coordinated elements were not incidental. They were negotiated, approved, and relied on. We along with our fellow residents moved to Searsstone expecting that this master plan, the Searsstone PDD would be honored by Carrie. Over the course of the development of the Sears Stone of the Sears Farm PD, the focus on retirement living has been a constant and Carrie's high development standards have not only been met but have been exceeded. The result is a vibrant senior community, beautiful buildings, homes, and community that we have today. The applicants resoning requests asked to be released from all, I repeat, from all of the existing requirements in the wellthoughtout Sears Farm PD. They seek to change the designation of continuing care retirement community and they want to introduce familyoriented housing without providing real family oriented infrastructure rather than use the elevated standards of the uh Sears Farm PD. They want to abi abide by the ordinary requirements of a town home that could be anywhere in Kerry. They want to use Sears Stone's private roads, the lake, and other amenities while abandoning the PDD.

If they want to use those amenities, they should be developing a continuing care retirement community thoughtfully integrated with Sears Stone. Anything less is an abandonment of the council's commitment to first class planning and development. There are no details in the reszoning [clears throat] request, not for us, the residents, and possibly not for you, the council. We think that the developer has a plan to develop uh 87 town homes at some indefinitely defined areas on the property, but they leave out all the specifics. Things like density, design, preservation of environmentally sensitive areas for a future time, a time in the future that will not allow for scrutiny and public comment. The applicant's resoning request asked to be removed from be released from all of the existing requirements in the Sears Farm PD. The request is not for incremental change. It is a major change and would result in eroding the Sears Farm PD. This is a master plan that Carrie has upheld for the last 24 years. We ask for your continued support of the very successful Sears Farm PD and for your rejection of this resoning request. Thank you.

Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Bill um

Kendall. [laughter]

You don't have to know everybody.

I know Bill knows Bill. [laughter] Come in.

Well, good evening. I am Bill Kendall. I'm a Sears Stone resident living at 840 Walkerstone Drive and speaking in opposition to the requested zoning change to the Sears Farm PD.

I've talked with many of my neighbors about this resoning and appreciate this opportunity uh to to [clears throat] uh to speak on this matter. My wife Carol and I moved to the Searsstone community four years ago and we love it here to love it there. This is our forever home. I will point out that we are in a unique situation where our house borders both of the lots in the proposed resoning. My intention this evening is to emphasize the growing need for senior housing in Kerry, the importance of providing housing that supports a continuum of care for retirees and how this relates to the proposed resoning request. Having a community that meets the needs of retirees has been a foundational principle of the Sears Farm PD since the beginning. It made sense then and it makes sense now. The live port chapter of the Imagine Carry Community Plan makes this quite clear. It explicitly calls for diverse housing and housing that serves the car's growing senior population, including life care communities such as Searsstone. As Mayor Weinre vividly showed us when he presented his state of care address at Searsstone, the percentage of people over 65 years of age in Kerry is rapidly growing. It has increased from 11.8% 8% in 2014 to 16.2% in 2024, a 37% increase in just 10 years. Seniors aged 75 and older, are projected to grow even faster. The great majority

of my fellow Searsstone residents, including me, are in this age bracket. It's a fact of life that as we age, we require more access to medical and support services such as assisted living, skilled nursing, and memory care like those provided at Searsstone. This factor was a major reason why my wife and I and many other fellow residents chose Searsstone. Just a little over two years ago, two of Car's three CCRC's, Sears Stone and Glenn Air, completed major construction projects that doubled their capacities. Today, neither have any units available for immediate occupancy, and both have years long wait list. All this in just two years. This leaves no doubt about the need for more, not less, housing to accommodate the unique needs of retirees. This applicant is asking Carrie to substitute a non senior 87 unit town home development for its currently designated use as a continuing care retirement community. There are already multiple town home communities in Kerry and others under active and proposed development. If allowed, this development would do nothing to enhance our steerstone retirement community and in fact would be highly detrimental. The imagine carry community plan emphasizes compatibility in transitions. The proposed development is not compatible and lacks any elements of transition with these two lots. The Sears Farm PD currently has over 17 acres zoned for senior housing. Let me be clear. These lots should be

developed, but only in a way that complements and amplifies our outstanding Searsstone continuing care retirement community in keeping with the totality of the precepts of the Sears forum PDD. In closing, allow me to suggest that the best way to ensure complimentary development is to retain the CCRC land use designation on the property. Please remember that the decision that you make will impact all of our lives. Thank you.

Thank you.

Our next registered speaker is Joy Harrington. Hello, my name is Joy Harrington. I live in Sears Stone at 837 Walker Stone Drive, adjacent to the proposed resoning. My apologies for a soft soft voice now that I'm over 90. Listen up. I'll try to speak [laughter] up. We moved to Kerry 11 years ago. My husband and I never expect my husband now deceased never expected to live in Kerry. We didn't live in Kerry and we didn't plan to move to Kerry. But when we arrived there and saw the beautiful architecture and the open grounds, the Searstone Lake with the generous setbacks, it changed our minds. Of course, we saw the undeveloped land next to our chosen home, but we were reassured that the land would always be restricted by Car's Town Council because it, like our community, was

included in a larger plan of development. This proposed resoning request seeks to break that promise. I'd like to focus on the design and density in the application as it relates to what now exists in our community. This reszoning proposes 87 town homes on lots 13 and 41. These two lots are treated as one reszoning even though a street divides them so that they seem entirely separate. without touching at any point. The south boundary of lot 41 comes right by my house and it terminates along the lake across from the clubhouse. It is the lakeside focal point for the entire Searsstone community. Yet the reszoning application does not commit to landscaping, barriers, BMS or any other design feature. There is nothing to filter sight and sound between our community and the reszoning along this shared boundary. Lot 41 is less than a quarter of the acreage of this of these two lots. less than a quarter. The rejoning shows several areas of town homes. The applicant states that these areas are conceptual and that the exact location could vary in the future. How much variation? Application does not say. We continue to see town homes proposed just feet from the Sears stone lake prominade. If that's not bad enough, the application makes no commitment to

density near Searstone or orientation, elevation, height, visual impact, or consistency of design and style with our community. Certainty is postponed until after resoning. We don't know how these homes will look. For example, they say that 40% will be brick, stone, or some other masonry material. Does that mean cement? No one wants surprises after reszoning. The building plan for both lots overall is based on the most minimal requirements. In the past, the application was transparent. Now specifics are withheld but consequence is the same. They want out of the PDD while at the same time using the Sears stone private street and amenities including our lake. We strongly ask you to uphold the intent of the original Sears Farm PDD and to protect our residents from the applicant's current plans. Please save the open view of the lake. We have a great continuing care retirement community. The current zoning adjacent to it should be maintained. All residents of Searsstone appreciate Car's insistence of high standards when land is developed. We ask that Car's design principles be upheld. Thank you. for letting me speak. We depend on you and your decisions. Thank you.

Thank you, Miss Her.

Our next register speaker is Larry Crane.

My name is Larry Crane. I'm an 83year-old retired physician who's made a home with my wife in Searstone for the last five years. We moved here from Durham because of our belief that Kerry offered better management of trees, water, and preservation of neighborhoods. Searstone offered better safety, open spaces, and land management than other senior facilities. I want to talk to you about some environmental and physical safety concerns. The property requesting to be reszoned is visible from my apartment. I walk by it every day. Both lots have very low areas that retain standing water even during drought periods typical of wet areas. Indeed, adjacent public streets have multiple drains into these lots. I found various maps showing streams, buffers, and wetlands on the property, but disturbingly none of them were represented on the developer application. Currently, the property requested to be reszoned is heavily wooded with additional shrubs and grass. And despite a statement in their resoning application, their plan show would all be clear-cut to pack in as many town homes as possible. Thoughtful urban development integrates environmentally sensitive areas into an innovative design, but the general nature of the resoning application doesn't preserve any of these things or provide adequate water drainage. We request at the very least some of these areas be preserved and protected through specific enforced zoning conditions. Our immediately adjacent continuing care retirement community has preserved storm water management, open spaces, grass, trees. We expect our neighbors to do the same. The resoning application requests the town council to change the zoning from a continuing care retirement community to single family residential development that can be as close as a few feet as

their map shows a few feet from our sidewalk around the lake. Even though our own buildings are set back 50 feet from that lake, the developer wants to take advantage of Searsstone's private walkways and amenities designed for the elderly and introduce new very mobile residents that will use our property and amenities for recreation because they have little significant space of their own. The developer plans even show a walkway from their homes down to our lake indicating that that poses safety issues for me and my community. Sir is not a typical neighborhood. You've seen it, you understand it. It's a home designed for seniors. It provides multiple levels of care. Searstone residents, by definition, are elderly, may have mobility problems. You saw me crumble up here. Uh, many of us walk around that sidewalk to remain healthy. All of our walkways and roads are currently separate from the adjacent nearby commercial establishments and lowerage individuals. So, we feel safe. Many of us just can't get out of the way of younger people's activities whose movements are faster and less predictable. We risk falling. We have a beautiful lake with swans and ducks in our campus home is surrounded by a concrete ballastrade. Now, as seniors with limited mobility, we can't enter the lake. But nearby, young people in the adjacent community that was proposed, they can enter the lake. Well, who will be responsible for the public safety of younger individuals from the adjacent community that can enter our lake or if they just have an accident on our property, which they clearly have a walkway to. Yet another safety issue is our private road, Walkerstone Drive. There will be an increase in different types of drivers from the proposed development using this road as a shortcut to Davis Drive. Many of us use

this road on foot. We travel to visit loved ones in a nursing home or merely just to get to one of the dining facilities. Outside drivers, however, will not expect to encounter slowmoving pedestrians who cross the roads on foot, slowmoving golf carts, or mobility scooters on these roads. And these interactions will put resident safety at risk. Our continuing care retirement community is a reality and helps with the demand for safe, comprehensive senior housing. Any development should be maintained as such and the current resoning request should be denied. Thank you so much for representing us. We appreciate it.

Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Betty Noal. Good evening. I'm Betty Noly. I live at 108 Walkerstone Drive in Kerry. I'd like to talk about economics and fairness, not abstract theory, but our personal reality. My husband and I moved to Searsstone six years ago. We sold our home of 32 years in Northern Virginia and put all our proceeds into Searsstone. That and what did we get for the that we got a roof over our heads, but more importantly, we got care or the potential of having care in our healthc care facility, Britney Place. We selected Searsstone, a not-for-profit entity, because it has an attractive financial model. When someone moves to Searsstone, they make two substantial payments. One is for housing and the other is for a life care plan, and that

guarantees health care if they need assisted living, skilled nursing care, or the memory unit. Additionally, Searsstone residents pay a monthly fee that goes towards operating costs. The life care fee and the monthly fees are non-reoverable costs. The housing outlay is our investment. The current Searstone residents have put a large portion of their retirement savings in housing, collectively $189 million. Their expectation is that the investment will be returned to us or to our estate when that we vacate the housing unit. A high occupancy rate helps with resales of housing units which is necessary for the return of our investment and also in keeping our monthly fees low. Although the community has a long waiting list, we exist in a highly competitive market. Anything that causes seniors to think twice about moving to Searsstone about not moving to Searsstone puts our investment at risk. One of Searstone's main advantages is its beautiful, safe, and spacious campus. I know most of you have seen that we surround a lathe that's visible from many units as well as from our dining rooms and our amenities, our gym, our shuffleboard courts, and our botchi courts. If the property around Searsstone is developed in a way that's inconsistent with the continuing care retirement community and jeopardizes the quality and desiraability of Searsstone, our lifetime of savings is in jeopardy. Our financial future relies on avoiding this unfair outcome. There's little doubt in my mind that

Searstone's a major economic contributor in the town of of Kerry and Wake County, employs more than 200 people, 60 of whom live in Kerry, and it generates a payroll of over 9 million annually and spends millions with local vendors. Additionally, our residents have made significant financial contributions to local charities and spend many hours doing volunteer work. Truly, Sears Stone residents and employees are deeply engaged in Car's civic and nonprofit life. In the past couple of months, I feel like I've taken a crash course in zoning, reszoning, PDDs, setbacks, and buffers. [laughter] I've learned that the purpose of reszoning is not to relieve hardships or to confer special privileges or rights, but only to adjust in light of changed conditions or to advance the general welfare. Current zoning designated the two lots for continuing care retirement community. Now, the applicant is dissatisfied and wants the lots reszoned. This application fails to meet the criteria for resoning. The demand for retirement living is high and nothing in this resoning advances the general welfare. In fact, the reasonzoning would jeopardize and abandon a successful PDD for no general welfare reason. I hope you understand why we feel it would be terribly unfair and economically harmful to Searstone residents to approve this reasonzoning request. Personally, I'm not afraid of growth or against growth. I would welcome development that supports and enhances the tenants of the Sears Farm PD. Stability is not anti-growth.

It's a form of economic stewardship. Thank you. Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Cindy. [snorts] Thank you for carefully listening to our concerns. My name is Cindy Simson and my address is 1901 Searsstone Drive. My husband and I moved from Raleigh to Kerry two years ago to make Searstone our home. Unlike the applicant who will build, sell town homes, and move on to the next project, we will live with the consequences of this development for the rest of our lives. You have heard my fellow residents talk about how we feel about Kerry and Searstone and the quality of life we've been afforded by choosing to live here. We have shared with you our thoughts on the ways this resoning request seriously erodess that quality of life and the tremendous uncertainty it has caused. The resoning disregards the growing need and strong market for retirement housing right here in Kerry. To be able to build without regard to contextsensitive design, without the quality of the materials used in the buildings, without meaningful setbacks, buffers, and landscaping jeopardizes the future of our forever home. We're disappointed the zoning application suggests that housing diversity supports granting this application when there are many areas in Kerry appropriate for ordinary town homes. This development's adjacency to Sears

Stone, coupled with the very existence of the Sears Farm PD law, leaves little doubt that this property is best suited for the special housing of a continuing care retirement community. The resoning request is so indefinite in design, transitions from existing structures and sightelines and so lacking in amenities and open space appropriate to children and families living in close proximity to a senior community and so devoid of any concern for the preservation of trees, green spaces, and environmentally sensitive areas. and so lacking in regard for the safety and welfare of our 500 residents and the substantial investment we made in Sears Stone, it does not justify approval of this resoning. I will close this evening by returning to where we started. The Sears Farm PD was approved to create a unified mixeduse community centered on a continuing of care for residents enjoying their retirement years. That intent aligned with Car's long range vision, thoughtful housing choice, environmental stewardship, contextsensitive design, and respect for those who invest their lives here. The proposed reasonzoning request to divorce the applicant's purpose, intent, and design for the substantially developed nearly 25 year old master plan represents a qualitative shift away from that vision. It appears to be motivated by prioritizing unit count over compatibility, intensity over transition, and efficiency over stewardship. Any change this major should require a reason of the same magnitude and none has been

given. We thank each one of you for visiting our Searsstone home, for walking with us and for talking with us about the importance of what is before you. All 500 of Searsstone's residents have made a significant commitment to live the rest of our lives at Searsstone in Kerry. We ask you to honor the commitments embedded in the original council approval of the Sears Farm PD and reaffirm that Car's plans mean something, not just on paper, but in practice. All of the residents here in these blue shirts and many back at Sears Stone are asking you to deny this request. When the development doesn't fit, do not permit. Thank you so much. [laughter]

Our next pres speaker is Tom BB.

You have to be a certain age to get that.

I might be able to get my family watch part of tonight.

I don't have a rhyme. I can tell you [laughter] Mayor and members of the council, my name is Tom BBE. I'm here as a member of the board of directors of Samaritan Housing Foundation. That is the owner of Sears Stone Community Retirement Community and independent of of the residents. Obviously, Sears Stone is also local nonprofit. It's a CCRC and the board of directors are a group of primarily local residents uh involved in the civic business and social life of Kerry. Among the current directors, Linda Coleman uh local resident been on the general asse uh elected to the general assembly uh on the Wake County Board of Commissioners. uh the North Carolina Department of Community Colleges, Wake Tech, and a variety of other uh organizations. Mark Huitt, a local attorney specializing in healthc care

related issues uh including CCRC's. Chuck Norman uh involved in uh part owner of a of a communications and public relations uh business here uh in town, also active in the Kerry Chamber. Jim Pierce, a local resident, Sears Stone resident. Uh, and until retiring, he was a partner in a CPA firm, Williams Overman and Pierce, and myself, an old Kerry High School graduate. Uh, [laughter] yeah, longer than I can even remember. [snorts] Uh, went off to school, came back, practiced law, was in the real estate development business here for for years. Um, the board has two other non-local members, Stan Braiding and M Leaf, both with significant experience and expertise in uh, bond financing and and uh, CCRC operation. The board has worked with the Sears family and the town for over 25 years to take this vision of Sears Stone uh, from dream to reality. The town has consistently reviewed it, approved it, and always been faithful to the original concept of the CCRC plan district. The staff's report described the continuing care retirement community use as an age restricted for senior living uh with multiple levels of care and housing. And that's exactly how it has developed. The non-commercial land in this plan district has successfully developed as a CCRC with hundreds as you can as you've heard hundreds of residents. The current PDDD master plan uh designated this property uh subject to this application also to be used for one purpose and that was very specialized use of CCRC continuing care retirement community. the use is a special designation and the master plan's uh design assumes that this property will continue uh as a

CCRC. One example would be if the staff recom staff did recommend uh completion of an internal pedestrian network uh that was designed for retirees. This recommendation works as long as the property is an age restricted or senior environment. uh it doesn't work so well when you've got kids or younger people, runners, bikes, whatever. Uh it doesn't work as well and the town's own policy requires the network to ensure the safety of all users. uh even if uh even if it didn't develop exactly according to the original uh plan, the proposed development does connect to Sears Stone in a multiple uh multiple points and uh uh the proposed reasonzoning request is essentially I think seems to me trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Um I've never known this town to settle for just good enough. Members of our board, including myself, have met with the applicant on a number of occasions. We do not oppose these tracks being developed. Uh we would welcome that provided we believe they are developed in accord with the PDD for age restricted senior living that is context sensitive. Um, this is a unique opportunity to build age restricted, age targeted housing right next to a CCRC. There is no better place to do that. Uh, I was in the real estate development business. I know I did Woodland Terrace years ago. Um, I I I understand this business. This is a very unique opportunity. Uh we have concerns uh product uh dedication for age population uh compatibility of the building architecture uh particularly along the lake having an adequate building location. Uh their their original drawing showed a building

envelope within 8t of the walkway around that lake. That's six feet. My wife measured it this morning.

8 feet and you got 42 foot high building. That's problematic in our

I'm sorry I've got to cut you off. Your time has expired, but I really appreciate your comments. Thank you.

That's our last registered speaker.

Okay,

if you are in the audience and would like to speak at this public hearing, now's your opportunity and I would invite you forward. Anyone else to speak at this public hearing? Seeing no one, I'll close the public hearing. Oh, after this.

Okay. that was planned, but

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Um I I want to thank the residents for being engaged and being here. I know this means a lot to you. Means a lot to me that you're here and you care. Uh where we are in the process is that this will go to an advisory board called the planning and zoning board and they're going to review it and see how it matches the Kerry community plan. They will take a vote, but that vote is not binding. that vote is an advisory to us how they think it matches the Kerry community plan. Then it will come back to us for a vote. This is going to take several months and so I would invite you to stay involved in the process and Erin, you're the contact. Aaron Pucket will have the latest and greatest information. If you can't remember our name, you can always email me or anyone else and and we'll put you in contact and get the latest information for you. Having said that, um I want to talk to the applicant. Um I'm the only council member that was here in 2002. I was part of that decision and I gave Bill Sears a hard time and he responded to every request I made. So much so that when it came up for a vote, I advocated for him

and for this proposal. Having said that, I know that vision very well because I was part of helping craft that and I still see that vision today. So my challenge to the applicant is you've heard we have a growing need for senior housing here in Kerry and I totally agree with that and actually it's in my state of Kerry. Mr. Kaikandall mentioned that you've got to convince me that the vision you talked about is better than the vision we had 24 years ago because I'm not seeing it. And so that's your challenge for me to get my support. Um so I always to everyone I always keep an open mind to every proposal, every applicant until it's time to vote. Uh but that's where I am on this one. So, it's a big challenge for you to get my support. Um, and so I would at this time open it up to my colleagues for their comments and their remarks.

Um, I do have some questions. Um, can you explain a dry pond

because I don't remember that.

Yes. It's a type of storm water facility that typically the LDO today does not allow from an aesthetic perspective because we require something like a wet pond or a biocel that has plantings. Um so there's a little bit of a complicated history with the dry ponds that are currently there. They're shown in the green blobs on this map. Um they were never actually completed and certified. So, this would be expanding something that's out there that was shown on a previous development plan, but um does not meet our aesthetic requirements today.

It it doesn't meet our aesthetics, our requirements for our SCMs in general, our storm water control measure,

right? But development of this site, if the resoning is approved, they would have to meet all of the storm water mitigation requirements. They would not have to meet our pretty requirements,

but they would have to meet the storm water mitigation still. Um, I have a bunch of questions, but my my fundamental comments is uh really in line with what um the mayor said. This is a fundamental change to the character of the development. I mean it's a it's it's almost part and parcel to what we do here which is to decide if a land use is appropriate and a reasonzoning to when it comes to us is about understanding the need the type of use the need in the community and the type of use and I'm we just heard a couple work sessions ago that 16% of our community are seniors and it's growing rapidly and we're the oldest community out of all the municipalities

top 14

top 14. So we don't approve resonings just because the numbers work out. um we approve them when they serve the community's needs. And there have been times where we've changed our mind where there were changes in the community um evolution of a neighboring community which made sense to change the need. Um and it in turn advances our our adopted plans. But I need to understand and I and I haven't yet and I don't right now how eliminating senior housing does that when the absolute opposite is true. So that's where I fundamentally um as well

other thoughts comments

I'll jump in. Thank you mayor. Uh as your district a representative I am your neighbor just down the street uh and I'm very familiar with this corridor. you've welcomed me to your community with open arms many times. So, thank you for hosting me. Uh, I would equally like to

thank the applicant for being very generous with their time as well. We've had many conversations. And what I appreciate most is the applicant was very mindful about density. At a time when we are hearing resonings that significantly increase the density, I I think the applicant uh thought carefully about what was a good fit for here. But as we heard from the residents today, I I think we still have some work to do, especially for lot 41. Lot 41, as I have shared with the applicant, is I I think I've heard from all of you of particular concern just being so near the lake. Uh I had shared with the applicant uh you know we we had brainstormed together some ideas of of ways that we could address that. We had talked about landscaping. One of our speakers today mentioned BMS. Uh we've talked about the elevations of what those units could be. Uh because when I visited you, we talked in particular about concerns about quite frankly unsightly backyards and looking at patios and barbecue grills. and I've shared with the applicant uh you know uh I've asked the applicant to take a a second look at what we could do to address those concerns if it's changing the elevations and maybe having rear loaded units on the lake so that you were potentially having uh the front of the unit face the lake. Uh so I I'm hopeful that this process works as it should, which is we hear from you, we converse with the applicant, both parties have a dialogue with one another so that we continue to shape the application in a way that is mutually beneficial. Uh, you know, some other ideas that I heard tonight was, you know, I I think there is concerns about the lake being the most attractive amenity in the community. And so I hear that potentially if there was a way to

offer more family centric amenities on either of the lots as something to draw that population to their dedicated amenity. That's one idea. Um, you know, again, looking at the the frontage on the lake there, I appreciate that the applicant has shared that there are business constraints. You know, that's why we were here at the resoning tonight, that there are are business constraints about age restricting the property, about restricting the number of units, about moving the number of units. But just another request to sharpen those pencils and and I will agree too and I have shared this with the applicant before that one of my main concerns when looking at applications is the environmental impacts the impacts on tree canopy. Uh I understand that there is as is so often true in our Piedmont lots some funky topography here and that there's going to be some major grading required and that's that's probably the case no matter what gets built here. And as we heard tonight, this is not really a conversation about whether or not these lots are developed, but what is built there. But I have expressed to the applicant, I would love to see more conditions mindful of the green spaces of uh conditioning, keeping some of the mature trees that are on the lot. Uh maybe voluntarily increasing those buffers. Uh Mayor Prom dry pond was also new to me. Uh, so maybe some voluntary conditions there as well to meet the current LDO standard for aesthetics. Um, and so I'm I'm I'm hopeful that the conversation can continue and and as it progresses through the process, like the mayor noted, that we can continue to improve and planning and zoning will take a look and then it'll come back to us uh likely in several months for us to consider it again. And uh this is my first opportunity. I've talked with all

of you. Like I said, I've talked with the applicant, but this is the first time I'm hearing from my colleagues, so I appreciate their thoughts. I I hope everyone else will weigh in.

Other thoughts?

So, I will I did not hear what you both said, and I apologize if um I'll repeat the same thing. I'm very uncomfortable today. I have allergies slashinfection in both the ears. So, it's very painful, but I really wanted to stay here just so that you know I could hear everybody and I can really um understand where you're coming from. So, I appreciate you coming today and sharing your thoughts. Almost nine out of 10 every project that we I have um reviewed as a council member um I've always felt that you know we we actually had a better product in the end when the community worked very closely with the applicant. It's always a win-win to have you know um um both sides um meet somewhere in middle. I know we cannot be 100% um on the same page but my wish is that you all will work and continue to work together but um I will just give you my my thoughts here. Um I personally feel that this should be an age restricted community. um we should maintain the character of the sea stone and have you know a certain aspect of that kind of get to the next phase which is I know it's not really a continuation or a phase of sar stone but have at least maintains um some character and I know I have like thank you for inviting us and thank you for showing every detail um because it matters Um, when I was walking through that trail, I also felt around the lake, I felt it's

like the jewel of the community and you all want to protect and you love dearly. And I could see the smile and the shine in your eyes when you were talking about it tonight and when we met um in in the community. So I understand where you're coming from that you want to make sure that you know the character of the community is maintained so that you know we can protect the jewel and um I totally understand and I hope the applicant will also value that that um aspect while making some decision to move forward.

Okay. Other thoughts comments?

Sure. This definitely feels like a unique proposal considering [snorts] there aren't that many community care um retirement communities. And so I've never heard a proposed change like this. I'm assuming you haven't either before now. And I'm

once we had an apartment complex that asked us to remove an age restriction. Yeah. A year or two ago.

Well, I mean, was it a part of a larger where it was all restricted?

It was part of a but it wasn't already built.

So, what I've been trying to think is how does this compare to other plan development districts which have evolved over time? And so not tonight, but before this comes back to us, I would like information more from staff. Maybe this may be a unique question that I have, but so I obviously have a different plan development district in my head tonight because we will be voting on that later. My understanding of that was it started out years ago is all office. So there were

no res and you can correct me if anybody [clears throat] if I am wrong but so there were no residents there initially. So the impact was different than people moving to um what they knew to be an age restricted. So I I don't have any some so many times it's it's good to say well how what have we done before and why? Not that we should always do it that same way but it's a good starting place. So, it's hard to have a starting place here. And someone used the word fairness earlier and that that's so so important to me. So, definitely understanding the residents um hearing you with your concerns for safety and coming in knowing that it was going to be age restricted. I'm sure many of you maybe all made decisions based on that. So I'm thinking on another perspective, PDDs who have changed over time where it was office and then it became office and residential but people wanted to hold on to single family homes but those have moved the proposed for multif family. It just feels like a different dynamic. However, those people very deeply care that what they believe they bought a home changed and to them feels equally bad about that change because that's not what they signed up for. So, I want to continue to have an open mind and see of course um what planning and zoning has to say about that and their ideas about how it matches the Kerry community plan. Um the things I appreciate are um the applicant adding walkability. Going to want that with any project and environmental sustainability. I do have some specific questions, Aaron. Um did did Edinburg make updates to the lake?

Say one more time. I'm sorry.

Did the developer did the applicant make

updates to the lake? Something I remember in a conversation hearing. There's a trail along the north side that I believe that the current property owner did build, but the applicants team could confirm that. I'm not aware of the details.

Okay. And is it true I'm hearing about the original plans being up to 8 foot to the lake, but my recollection was that's not what the current proposal looks like. So I think the best sort of graphic that I have for this the last proposal for this site I showed on an earlier slide. Um we probably saw two hours ago. So [laughter] um the this portion that's closest to the lake kind of shows where that multifamily building could go today. Um so that's about the proximity of the lake. So it is set back a little further. Kind of has a courtyard in between.

Okay. um not quite as close as maybe they're showing on the

I did want to make sure that residents had current information as well and

and I don't believe it establishes a specific minimum on that old PDD. We could verify, but I think it intentionally kept it a little bit.

And I absolutely agree with the previous comments. I I don't know that I've seen anything that looked the same at the end. Um, most things that I see initially would be a hard no. Almost everything I've seen um in the in the beginning, but you know, we all have a starting place and I've often seen very good projects come at the end. So, as you said, I'm I'm hopeful um that, you know, we see some changes. Um just a a comment for the applicant when you were reading about um from the community plan about how in addition to senior options um the need for more housing options for all residents and I was writing as you were saying and you included in all incomes. Um, I would

like to see every proposal um specifically address diversity in income for housing

and haven't seen um haven't seen too much here. Just that's a just a comment for anybody. That's it.

Bella, we always make you go last. Would you like? [laughter] because this is my first um like the first project to for the public hearing with so many green t-shirt blue t-shirts [laughter] and uh last time uh Michelle two of us right went to the uh Sears Stone and I really love that neighborhood. It's really nice especially the lake. Um, and I I I heard that a lot of concerns about environment and safe safety issues and I totally understand that for seniors they need a safer place around and in their neighborhood. Uh, also we tal Britney and I talked to the applicant uh a few weeks ago and we also heard their um their concern about uh continuing uh develop the uh the senior town homes. So they have their reasons and uh especially for the three stories uh town homes they need to install elevator which make the town home will be uh not so affordable for a lot of seniors and also after pandemic uh the everything have changed and not only for the seniors uh all the housing and nationally changed the price and And I heard that uh the residents at Sears Stone, they invested all their their life savings into this

neighborhood and wishing to exp um to spend them their life there and that's really important. Um but this is the public hearing which is the greatest uh opportunity for the residents to communicate with applicant. I feel uh I I feel the continuing conversation will be very helpful and also the lake area that's really very nice place you want to keep that area and you want to the view only the swans over there I totally understand and I think this is um yeah we keep the conversation and I know only mayor had made that decision 24 years ago right it's really long it's were you on PNZ?

I was not on PNZ yet.

Okay.

Until 20.

Yeah. So, uh, a lot of things have changed. I I want I want everyone to feel um all everyone feel it's a good decision for the future. So, it's not easy as I have heard like I'm I'm feeling on the console. It's not an easy job. Uh, and I I was thinking why I decided to run for this seat. [laughter]

Rethinking it.

You never told me. You never shared with me that

it's too late. [laughter]

Yes, we did.

You missed the vote on that. Now you're here.

But I want to express that I'm all ears. I want to listen to everyone, the residents, also the applicants, and that's keep the conversation. And um that's so important our council is. So I'll listen to the um uh planning and zoning board's uh suggestions and keep dialogue going.

Thank you. I'd

like to start with a few questions as is my habit. Um, first and foremost, I want

to make sure I understand when we talk about age restriction in Kerry, is it uniformly 55 and over?

So, that's typically what we would see today. Um, this resoning, which was 24 or 25 years ago, does not have that specific condition legal language that we would typically want to get today that establishes that minimum age. It just speaks more in generalities about age restriction, CCRC. Um, so

is that also true of Searsstone? Could could a 45year-old move into Searsstone?

That would be based on their covenants, but it sounds like probably no.

Okay. So, with the current covenants of the PDD though, there isn't a defined um minimum age.

There's not um there's not in the the original 2002 PDD.

I thought so. Um

I'll verify that, but I've looked and I couldn't find one. I

I I couldn't find one either. Um that's why I'm asking that question. Sometimes I don't have my glasses on. Um, and that's Can you tell me the difference between a sidewalk and a side path? Or maybe one of my colleagues can edify me in.

Yes. So, sort of our side our sidewalks. Um, typically those are five feet in width, sometimes six feet maximum in certain situations. Um, you all saw our forthcoming updates to our move and engage chapters. You had a public hearing for those some month ago, I believe. um those are redefining and adding some new terms and it really depends on the width of that. So gets a little fuzzy between side path and street side trail. Those definitions start to overlap. Really the the distinction here how we're speaking about them. Those side paths are typically like your 8 to 10 foot wide feature. That 12 foot wide feature they'll be installing along high house is going to be closer to our new street side trail

width but not quite just a little bit shy of that. Right. eight feet

uh eight feet from this development to the west Davis, but it will be the tw the full 12 foot wide facility from Lily

Ridge Road east.

And that's a side path. And if it was 15 feet, it becomes a streetside trail.

10 feet and up is technically a streetside trail, but again, there's overlap between that side path definition and our streetside trail definition. I asked because this is the first time I've seen side path used in a significant way and the word sounds like it'd be lesser than a sidewalk and I wanted to make sure I understood that you know exactly what it is wider than a sidewalk. It is okay

and so people can pass each other without my dog having to go into somebody's lawn.

Yes. The hope is that it's getting closer to that minimum width that could actually accommodate multimodal. You could even have a pedestrian and a bicyclist. Okay. hypothetically on that same

that's helpful. Thank you. Um and I I do have a question about the private roads. This comes up every time we have private roads involved in any of these projects, especially the resonings. So in this case, Searstone has what we don't allow anymore, and that's a that those are privately maintained roads for those paying attention, meaning they shoulder the cost of maintaining those roads um built and maintained. And so we do our LDO requires connectivity, but does it require connectivity always to a private roads? That's a a question that I I don't feel like I've gotten a solid answer on.

Yes. So in the typical scenario, yes, there's always a little bit of a it depends. Um, in this particular situation, so Carrie does still allow private streets for commercial or for multif family. So that's actually not necessarily deviating the the portion of Searsstone that's built out as the commercial village and the retirement community,

but not bungalows and town homes,

right? So the town homes is what would trigger the public street requirement. Okay.

Um what we will look for if this is approved and it goes to development plan is they should be making some sort of transition where the public and private streets align. A lot of times you'll see

that facilitated with a roundabout. um they have some mortage in their PDP that they'll work with staff on the appropriate treatment for example where Walkerstone what you see here will be public but then it'll eventually connect to private

the private so they'll need to make sure there's some sort of visual delineation. Um so it is a scenario that we do see happen from time to time and there are scenarios where we do still allow private streets but not for town homes any longer. So they would have to provide the public for this corner of of the development.

Okay. Thank you. Um,

do you mind if I jump on your question? I

I gave my feedback about age restriction and then forgot about one of my questions. There was a streetscape issue that staff brought up that the proposal attempts to keep the 30-foot type A streetscape, which is what was approved in 20 or 2002,

but we've already moved to 50 foot streetscapes.

Yes. Yes. Am I getting that right or

That's correct. So the PDD has a 30-foot entitled today. If this were starting from scratch, we would start from the LDO default requirement of 50. Um because they are in a PD with a preliminary development plan PDP. It is a flexible zoning district, they can choose to ask to retain that 30, which is what they are asking for.

Okay. that would I mean if we're giving feedback on everything I gave my strong feedback early on and I'm so glad you brought up like housing choice and affordable and even though these I think are um are not for rent but they're owner occupied I don't know how they would do that but it's I'm so glad you brought that up but yeah the streetscape issue um it was kind of glaring to me that we're already a 50- foot streetscape they want to go in some respects back to 2002 which was 30 foot but it really should be at at 50 feet and that is um something that I think staff called out

as well and and I appreciate what I did not do my appreciation for the applicant and to the incredible number of people who have shown us um such great and thoughtful and professional um and really just above and beyond what I mean just even giving us all of your notes of what you said because I was frantically taking them. I would really like to thank all of you for that. Um, yourospitableness was great. And to the applicant, I think there are some great ideas. Um, I I love how you got rid of some of the town homes, but I I still feel that if we're talking about use, um, I still want it to be for seniors. So, thank you for allowing me to jump in.

Of course, I were thinking alike.

Yeah. Yeah, you weren't you weren't here.

I was not listening to you. [laughter]

Um, I have another question here. I think this is probably for the applicant or the applicant's representative. Um, you mentioned an energy efficiency score that they'd like to measure their their units against. Um, and I'm wondering if that's a a an established standard or or that I might be familiar with. Um, I'm assuming it's more than a leads certification from your language. I thought perhaps you would would have said leads if it was that, but

I will make sure to get the right um terminology, but it's the ResNet score of

my

So, ResNet stands for the uh residential energy services network home energy rating system. So, it's ResNet HERS. It's a score equal to or less than 45 is the standard. So we originally filed with this zero home standard but over the course of this project that program may be going away. So we had to find a new standard.

The condition also allows to us to adapt if this new standard then is phased out

that we have to meet a similar standard in the future.

Excellent. Thank you. I was really impressed um when when you described that uh when we meet when we met. Um I have one remaining question before you walk away too far. Um, [laughter] I want to be really transparent. Um, much like my colleagues mentioned, we were invited to Sears Stone uh and and invited to take a tour, put on a bus and shown an exceptional amount of hospitality. So, we we did get to see the the entire community or at least most of it. And we also were able to meet with the applicant, the applicants, all of them, and their their attorney. Um, so in that process, we got a lot of background information and perspective from both groups. It was really challenging because I did the tour of Searsstone first was absolutely charmed and uh it would have made the decision much easier if I never met the applicants and didn't find them also charming. Um I I really was you know both groups everybody was [clears throat] exceptionally civil and really you know forthcoming and straightforward with everything. So I just want to say thank you while you're standing there waiting for me to ask my question. Um, but I I want you to describe to me a little bit better what when I was asking about the land where the uh the the circle around the lake was completed and how that came about, how it came about that the that the applicant in fact did the construction.

Yeah.

And who paid for it?

So when the u when Edberg Development bought this property, lot 41, which has all of our frontage along the way lake

in what year?

That would have been 2020 that we closed. Um that lake was a U. it was not connected. Um, at that time we had been working with Searsstone and the ownership and had friendly discussions about our redevelopment plans. Um, and as part of those friendly discussions, we understood we believe that they were in support of our project moving forward. And as a gesture of goodwill, we built out that extension to complete that circle. Um, and then dedicated it to Searsstone for the benefit of their

residents. Now, it is a public sidewalk, so it's already accessible by all the public. Um, but that was a about a $350,000 gesture at a time when we thought that we were proceeding with a project that was uh supported by the community.

Thank you.

And is can I ask Oh, sorry. I think And is that entire sidewalk uh public? Is that that was one of the questions I had when we all met. Yeah, I believe staff confirmed that it is indeed public. Has [snorts] a it's a it's privately maintained with a public access easement, which means that the public today has the right to use that sidewalk.

The entirety of the around the lake,

correct?

But the ownership was conveyed to Searsstone for maintenance. Is that correct?

It's a joint ownership. I think that's what they told me. So, our our most current plat only show the public access easement on this property. Um, from what we can find, we can't find a public access easement on the rest of the U. But

so, so you can walk just where they built and then walk off if you're a public.

Am I getting that right? I'm not trying to be I'm just trying to [laughter]

I'm just trying to understand what what does public mean? makes it public like how did that tiny little

with our deputy attorney like

Sure. Um so when when these are built they are owned by the prop the underlying property owner until an action is taken to grant the right to the public just as you would grant a right to any individual easement owner. Property owner has the ability to grant it to the public at large. And in many of our our developments, the developments, it's it's a requirement that if you have roadways, even if they're private, you still need to uh put a private access easement over them to allow for uninhibited use by the public at large. And so that is what apparently I believe what is shown for certain on this uh the property that

connected it. And I think Aaron, what you're saying is that we have not been able to find any definitive. It doesn't mean it doesn't exist, but we we were not we haven't been able to find any definitive proof that there was a public access easement granted on the remainder or what was the U I think as as Marsh talked about it. That doesn't mean it's not there,

but it I I believe when your question came with the time between you asking the question and Aaron standing there this evening, nothing has been located by our staff.

Okay.

We'll commit to working with staff to get you a better answer.

Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate

Can I ask just one? No, no, you're good. Um just one last question. At what um stage

you mentioned that you know the you build that uh out of good faith that the project is moving forward. Were the residents aware at that point that you're taking out the age restriction or the proposal will not have age restricted units there? At that point in time, our communications were primarily with the ownership or management of Searsstone rather than directly with the residents.

But at that point, even with those people, was this ever communicated that we will do this? But we're also our project, a future proposal is that we will remove the age restriction.

Yeah, I think in hindsight probably there should have been defined terms as to what was proposed, but it was in the course of friendly discussions between neighbors. Our intent was clear and it was a gesture of goodwill that we thought was you know a good thing to do at the time.

Can I another question? I think uh last time uh Bin and I with you had a a meeting you mentioned that you open the market is like marketing and check the needs of the community if you are going to build a age over a senior town home neighborhood and which showed not so attractive or I don't remember the

details could you repeat

yeah could you share a little bit more about trying to pre-ell to finance the

So Jim sitting back with me tonight um spent over a year uh trying to market and sell the approved CC units today. So again, just to be clear, they never intended to reszone this project or change what was envisioned. They intended to develop the CCRC units. Now, these units would have to be separate from Searsstone because it's not owned by Searsstone. they would have to be standalone, which is important as we think about what could come next because it has to be separate if it's separate ownership. But um Jim worked with a broker. They put out marketing materials and the way that they marketed this with open houses at Prestonwood Country Club uh once a month for 14 straight months. Um and that was marketing the lots or the units on lot 41 in particular, which are the lakefront units. uh they're about 29 and they needed to have meaningful interests and deposits in order to be able to finance the project to show lenders that yes this is viable. In the end they had about six interested parties but zero deposits. Um no one was willing to deposit. The feedback was these are far too expensive and the expense was based on the cost to develop it and then when expenses skyrocketed that's what put us in the we we can't make this work we have to do something else.

Thank you. Um A follow-up question there, would as uh the ownership is separate from the Searsstone community, would the individuals, if you were to move forward with an age restricted project on the on the these parcels, would the individuals there have any access to the amenities or the CCRC portion of Searsstone?

No, it would have to be a standalone entity. It's not part of Searstone. So, it' be age restricted and have no different amenities than if they bought a town home up the street from me.

Correct.

Okay.

I did not fully grasp that.

That's a good point.

Most of the smaller um age restricted ones are like that under 100 units.

Sure.

Okay. So, again, sorry, one more question. So um if you were to go move forward with the project sounds like that and I think what um when we when I went with the mayor to sir Stone that's what they shared with me as well that part of that um portion around the lake was actually a joint ownership between you uh your your applicant and their board. So which means that um if you were to move forward and if we were to find some solution, you cannot restrict the entry from lot 41 to coming into the lake. Um there's no way that we can stop that, right?

I don't believe so. All the feedback we've received until this point has been encouraging as much connectivity as possible throughout the corner that it's been developed in such a way that there's poor pedestrian connectivity and there's a number of sidewalk caps. And so we have been pushed to make every possible connection we can to make this more walkable for for everybody including the existing residents

by our staff. Correct.

Correct.

In our ordinances. I just wanted to share a couple of more um perspectives. Uh I I've shared with some of the residents and I believe with the applicants as well and a couple of times from the day that I uh did study gerontology. I do have an affinity for older adults. Um I'm enjoying becoming one myself uh very much and and I do appreciate the need for especially housing that is really easily used by seniors. uh I didn't I don't look at this project as as straightforward as if I am an advocate for older adults then I

will not allow the age restriction uh to be removed. The way I see it, and I expressed this to the applicant, so I want to say it here now publicly, it what gives me heartburn is the idea of of three-story town homes that are, you really that don't have good accessibility, regardless of, you know, an individual's age. Um, I it would make me feel much better about considering the removal of the age restriction if the applicant was willing to commit to some universal design for some of the units. And I did tell them that when we met a few weeks ago, um, meaning, you know, low thresholds to no thresholds, uh, first floor living, m uh, bedroom, bathroom, full bath, laundry, kitchen. um that the it's I don't have any problem with them still being three stories, but one of the immediate thoughts in my mind is you you wouldn't just be building um non-age restricted homes if we were to allow the age restriction to be lifted right here next to the CCRC. It would be inaccessible housing uh for older adults and people with any kind of ambulation challenges. and that that just doesn't feel very good as somebody who does try to be an advocate for accessibility. Uh so I wanted to share that and um I really do just want to thank everybody involved in this for being this has been the most civil the the most civil reasonzoning with the meetings and going to talk to people that I've experienced in my almost four years on on council thus far. No mean people live in Searsstone as far as I can tell. And and really and truly this this applicant um I was very impressed. These are hometown folks uh who really care about Kerry and they're they're from

Kerry and they're investing in Kerry. So I just want to commend everybody for being so incredibly uh civil and and neighborly. So it's been it's been a pleasure. Anyone else?

I have one more additional thought. Hearing from residents uh express uh a lot of uncertainty about what this finished product currently looks like in its current form made me realize that council has been privy to some additional information. And I recognize that it gets tricky to share unconditioned parts of the application with residents because you don't want that to be confused as a as a promise. Um, is it that that's a a tricky a tricky balance to strike between showing what it could potentially look like if that's not a certainty of what it would look like. But, uh, Collier has a colleague here tonight who has, uh, put together a website for the other application we'll be considering later that gave those residents some indication of what the product would actually look like. And I think that visualization is so helpful. So in our continuing to encourage as much dialogue between the parties as possible, I think as much as the applicant can share with residents, um you know, as much as council has seen because I I will share with the residents here tonight that council has seen and I I think Collier you have your binder there perhaps uh has seen more specificity than it sounds like the residents have. And so to the extent that we can share more um and of course to the extent that any of what is shared could potentially be conditioned as more of a certainty, I think that would be helpful for folks too.

Yeah, I'm glad you waved in. That was the one last thing that I was thinking that I did not mention is having more specificity, more conditions, more idea of what consistent look and feel is like. If we're taking advantage of or if you want to take advantage of the fact that it's no longer a you and it's a

circle, then it should feel to everyone like it's part of that community.

Um, and then the other thing I would also say is I know that the TAR recommended a second turn lane. Um, right. And that was not provided as an option. Um,

define TAR.

Oh, sorry. the traffic analysis report. Thank you. Um, thank you. I keep forgetting. Um, which was on the northbound left turn lane um, on Davis. Um, and it said that the volumes weren't that high, but it's already I think a level of service E, which means failing, which is not doing too well. So, I would really appreciate if the applicant could look at what it would take to include that as well, but that would make it um safer um easier for people to get in and out and uh traffic to flow. So, I didn't want to leave that on the table as we're talking about everything we might possibly would like to be considered.

Anything else? All right. Hopefully, we've exhausted thought we've had. But, um, this process continues. It's early in the process. As I said earlier, this is months. This isn't your only opportunity to speak. You can come at every council meeting and speak on this topic or any topic. Uh, either through public speaks out or public hearing. Um, and so that's my invitation to you. If you're passionate, you want to be heard, this is the place to be heard. It's your meeting. It's your council chambers. So, thank you again for being here and the council before we move to our next item is going to take a quick bio break. [laughter] So, thank you

We'll reconvene our council meeting at this time and move to our next public hearing which is the

recommended fiscal year 2027 budget. Assistant Town Manager Stacy Ti Ti will intro. Gosh, it's late already. We'll introduce this item and then we will open the public hearing. Council will not take action on this item tonight. Miss Teach.

Great. Thank you very much. Good evening, Mayor and Council. I'm here tonight for the first of two public hearings on the fiscal year 2027 recommended budget. I'll begin by sharing three key takeaways related to the fiscal year 2027 budget. This recommended budget is rooted in council and public priority input. It represents the single largest investment in public safety in K's history. And the fiscical year 2027 recommended budget is the first step in instituting a predictable, transparent approach to funding Kerry services. The fiscical year 2027 recommended budget totals 573.5 million, which is 12.2% higher than the current year budget. The operating budget makes up 440 $445.9 million of this total, which is 6.1% higher than the current year. The capital budget totals 127.6 million and is 40.7% higher than the current year budget. It is not uncommon to see significant differences year-to-year in the capital budget as these funds support infrastructure projects at varying stages of readiness. The recommended budget includes a 3.75 cents tax increase. This is equal to an additional $20 per month for the median assessed home value of $650,000. The solid waste and recycling fee is recommended to increase $2 per month to $28 and utility rates are recommended to increase 4% overall with the increase

applied to the base rate. This results in a $38 per month increase for the typical household. This budget reflects council priorities, the input of our advisory board's feedback from the community, and the town's biggest needs as identified by town directors and supervisors. The recommended budget includes a historic investment in public safety with nearly 20% of the total budget directed to public safety investments. It brings funding to new capital investments and reinforces our commitment to employees through the addition of 55 new positions and a focus on compensation through a classification and pay study and restoration of merit increase funding at 5%. The fiscical year 2027 budget also focuses on maintaining the infrastructure that is already in place. 54% of the capital budget supports maintenance projects like street resurfacing, facilities maintenance, and water and sewer and line rehabilitation. This budget is the first of a three-year smoothing approach, addressing rising operational costs alongside capital investment needs in a predictable and transparent manner. Council has been making steady progress on the budget since January. As you can see, as I keep saying, we've made it to the second page of to-do slides, which is lovely. Here we are at May 28th where we had a work session earlier this evening and this is the first of two budget public hearings that we will be holding. In addition to the budget openhouse held in April and two budget public hearings, we encourage residents to reach out year round via social media 311 and the public speaks out portion of any council meeting. This input is routinely shared with council through pulse reports and is summarized in each quarterly report. This concludes the staff overview of the fiscal year recommended budget and following the public hearing, I am available for any questions.

Thank you, Miss Titi.

I'll open the public hearing and call on the clerk for any written comments and call on any registered speakers.

We had four written comments. Um they have been emailed to council, provide to council upon arrival, and attached to the online agenda. Um we had six registered speakers starting with the speaker that we are bringing back from public speaks out Matthew um Conan.

Thank you for waiting. Sorry it took so long.

My uh cat needs to be fed, so hopefully I can get through this quickly. But ladies and gentlemen, thank you for having me. Uh once again, um much like the gentleman who was also a candidate for NCGA, I will introduce myself. I am Matthew Cordon. That's how to pronounce my name for uh district 11 of the house of the NCGA. Um but I'm also a constituent here in Carrie. That's the main reason that I come here to speak to you today. Uh I did not have a script before as you know, but I was with this given time able to prepare one. So I'm glad for that. And um though they're not here anymore, I was again astounded by the level of professionalism I've seen by my um constituents and neighbors um and wish to live up to that. Uh I will uh be quick for my subject um because I think it's excitement for many is pedantic or pardon me, I meant to I'm bombing. I meant to say um pedestrian um because uh I would like to thank all of you for uh the portion of the budget that is for sidewalks and for um as it was said earlier uh side paths um which I apparently like even more than sidewalks. I did not know that. Um and uh though thinking is a very quick and easy thing, it can be done by email. The reason why I'm here, however, is because I'd like to give a testimony to my own life experience as someone who has lived here for years to explain why it means so much to me sidewalks and side paths. Um, now in the three years I've lived here, I have been largely impoverished.

I have um needed to get by with um the wonderful uh go carry services here, the sidewalks available uh and an ebike that I ride around on which is a subject of ongoing regulation as of current in this city and Apex which is also part of my district as is all of Kerry and some of Raleigh for those who don't know of district 11 as well as um Holly Springs as recent. Um, now I would like to take a second to defend the importance of sidewalks and how it extends to people like myself, impoverished and those who ride around on eB uh ebikes, including in that group because ebikes are a way of life for some. It is their liberty, their mobility. It is uh with the addition of sidewalks, which some people use and not just uh to be on the roads, which are quite dangerous for people on ebikes, even if they use elbow pads and helmets and correct hand signs and so forth. um that it means so much to them because it allows them to uh consistently get around the town and um the sidewalks and their ebikes together. Uh and as such that um I've noticed also uh that people who use them, they do tend to use the sidewalks. Uh, in fact, people who use ebikes, they are uh 60% or more um perhaps 70% adults who use it to get to their job or to get home or as a part of their job or to transport from uh where they live perhaps or to the grocery store. It's not so much kids um who are uh popping a wheelie um or whatever it is that they do in their motor uh their motorbikes, though that does happen sometimes too and it is a problem worth regulating. It is however because it is twothirds of our of our adults who who were hanging on by a thread that as such that they should um have the consideration uh when doing regulation that uh if you are to uh require that they get plating for example registration that could cost

them a lot of money. Now I know uh ebikes are not plated the same way the cars are but some cars it cost them if e vehicle uh over $400 to register yearly. um for their vehicle because of the the tax incentives at the NCGA. Um that's a lot of money for somebody who's hanging on by a thread. And so I would like to use this opportunity to say not only are the sidewalks great as a part of this budget, the 3.7 million, but also what they do for people. Now, uh to end um

[snorts]

uh one moment, please. I care quite deeply about this subject and of infrastructure. Uh, and I I really appreciate to to go back to my thinking um that you all do as well. Um, I call it um opportunity infrastructure because that's what it is. Infrastructure allows us to have freedom and as a libertarian I care very deeply about that subject. So, thank you again.

Thank you. Our next register speaker is um Kamar about side pants.

Good evening everyone or now I suppose it's night. [laughter] My name is Om Kumar and I've lived at Kerry my whole entire life. I volunteer at Total Life Center, the senior center over at Bomb Park, and I'm a co-founder of the official 501c3 nonprofit, Everthrive Aging Initiative. We work to improve conditions for seniors across the area, and among other things, we spend time at senior homes and senior centers, helping them get more comfortable with technology in their lives. Since our founding, we have raised over $3,000, and we hope to raise over $1,000 more in the next year. Thank you for giving me a chance to speak today. I'm here to ask this board to increase the funding we set aside for our seniors in this year's budget. Let me start with something simple. The people we're talking about tonight are not strangers. They're the people who taught us in our schools, who ran our shops, and raised the families that are sitting in this room today. They built the town we're proud of. And not all of them. And now all of them are fixed are

living on fixed incomes that are not being increased as the cost of everything else increases. Food, medicine, and groceries, and even rent are all increasing. But their other their paychecks are not. When prices go up, a paycheck can grow, but pension and social security checks don't. Still, every year we hold senior funding flat and we are quietly asking our oldest residents, our parents, and our grandparents to do more with less. That is not a choice that I can live with. So, when we fund a senior center or a meal delivery or a ride program, we're not just buying items or services. We're buying them dignity. We're buying time spent at home instead of in a hospital. We're buying simple promises that getting old doesn't mean getting left behind. I'd like to ask the board to remember that this is one of the smartest investments that we can make. Every senior that we help stay healthy and independent at home is a senior who isn't ending up in a far more expensive hospital stay or care facility. And these are often paid out of the public's pocket anyways. Helping these seniors doesn't just feel right. It also saves this town money. We measure our community by how it treats people who can give the least for us in return. Our seniors already gave this town their lives and we're asking the we're asking and they're asking us to give us a little more back. In a budget this size, it's not a heavy lift. It's the right thing to do and I hope you all can do it. Thank you. And I'd like to introduce my partner, Ean Salwicker.

Mr. Kumar, could you repeat the name of your nonprofit, please?

We're part of Everth Thrive Aging Initiative.

Ever Thrive.

Yes.

Thank you.

And that's our next register speaker.

Greetings everyone. Uh, greetings board, greetings audience. My name is Ean and like M, I'm also a co-founder of the Ever Thrive Aging Initiative. So, the seniors in this area aren't just an abstraction to me. So, you already heard M go over the case um that holding senior funding flat is really just a cut and that helping people stay in their homes ends up saving this town money down the road. But when I think about seniors, I think about people like

Dorothy, a senior at the Total Life Senior Care Center. Someone who worked their whole life, gave her all into this town, and now finds that the hardest part of her day isn't even the cost of living. It's the quiet, the isolation. We don't always say this out loud, but for a lot of older people, a program isn't just a service. It is the one reason to leave the house that day. That one regular bit of human contact in a full week. Now, it's pivot. When we underfund these programs, the need doesn't just go away. It shows up later in worse, more expensive ways. A fall that could have been prevented. An emergency room visit that could have just been a phone call. Either way, we pay. The only question is whether we are ready to invest a little bit up front upfront to keep the people healthy or pay far more later after a crisis has already happened. Last year, Kerry approved a $2.75 million loan to help build affordable housing for low-income seniors. 81 apartments reserved for residents 55 and older. Now, that sounds like a lot, but to put this into perspective, a town like Kerry with more than 25,000 seniors. 81 homes is one home for every 310 of them. Now, watch just what what just 1 million more does. Use the same way as we've already been using it. 1 million helps bring about more about 40 more homes. That takes us from around 80 to around 120 homes. And 40 homes is enough for over every single person sitting in this room. A million dollars spent the same way as we have in the past turns a rounding error into a home for everyone here. And that's the difference that we can make. I'd also like to just point out that the town budget isn't just it's a moral document. It's a list of what we actually value put into dollars. So, I'd like to ask each and every one of you, when this budget is printed, will our seniors be able to look at it and see that this town still has a place for them and a place in our hearts? My ask is the same, and it's simple. Increase senior funding by a million dollars in this budget. Not someday, this cycle. And if the full amount can't happen tonight, then commit to protecting these programs and

building them back up. These are the people who took care of this town before any of us were even paying attention. All I'm asking is that we take care of them now. Thank you.

Thank you. Our next register speaker is Bruce Forester.

So cute. Kids know.

Could I get you to move to your left, please? Thank you, sir.

Good evening. Uh, as I said, my name is Bruce. My wife and I have been a resident of Kerry for about 37 years. I'm also a small business owner. Uh, a lot of the work that we do is in the town of Kerry. And, um, I'm also running for the state legislature, which is district 41, which encompasses about half of Kerry. Um, I care I I love Kerry. I care very deeply about Kerry and the people that live here. And that's why I'm asking you to reject a property tax rate increase going forward. Right. the the people of of uh not only Kerry but of course the entire country have been put in a very difficult position the past five years or so with it with the inflation that we've experienced. I don't think I have to tell you if you've been to the gas pump, the grocery store, right? People are in a in a difficult situation. Put that with the fact that wage and salary increases over the last five years have been meager at best. They've not kept pace with inflation and people are stretched to the limit. Right? I believe they they have had to make difficult decisions. They they have had to cut things out of their own personal or family budgets. Might be vacations. It might be deferring automobiles. Uh you know going to dinner. Whatever it might be,

they are in a difficult spot. And I believe they look to the council here representing the citizens of Kerry and want them to do to have you do the very same thing rather than proposing a budget with a 6% increase, let alone the the 40% increase of the capital budget, but but to look into where things are spent to make the hard decisions and to cut where needed so that there there's not an increase in taxes required. It's a slippery slope. You might say, "Well, it's only a small increase." It's a slippery slope to unaffordability. I'll bet the people in New Jersey who pay outrageous property taxes sit were sitting around 30 to 50 years ago going, "Well, it's not that much now, but it gets out of hand." the the the people in the in in really the country, but especially here in Kerry, one of the hallmarks has been it has been a reasonably affordable place to live. Please don't make it unaffordable for the citizens of Kerry. They they need they need your help and assistance in in being able to continue to make their own personal budgets meet and and not be so stretched. Thank you very much. Thank you.

Our next register speaker is Arthur Roa

and followed by Trudy. Shall we move the Trudy next? [clears throat] So, my name is my name is Trudy Onsorg and I live at 104 Finn Castle Drive. So,

this morning, as I was thinking about what I would say to you today, I was waiting to get my annual service done on my 10-year-old cargo van, Vanna White. I love Vanna. She can tow 5,000 lbs. comfortably holds a 4 by8 sheet of plywood or a lot a whole lot of plants. Gets decent gas mileage and she fits in my garage. All the things I need and just about everything I want. So, it's worth investing the 200 bucks once a year as needed to keep her in good condition because I have realized you get what you pay for. Delayed maintenance always causes problems. So, on a similar note, the town of Kerry is asking me to pay another $240 to keep it running smoothly this next year. I've got to admit, I love this town. Gary is not, as I feared when I moved here about four years ago, another soulless suburb. Gary has a real vibrant downtown. Parks, trails, festivals, classes. It's safe. There is just loads of character and charm. This town has everything I need and almost everything I want. Is Carrie perfect? No, of course not. But is Carrie worth investing in? Heck yes. Um, I just want to say this is the fourth house I've owned in my life and the property taxes here are so much lower. It's incredible to me what I get for what I pay. I have been consistently impressed with the professionalism of Carrie and the services that it

provides. and kudos to you to making this work so well. Um, please don't make the mistake of degrading the services that Carrie has now. Um, that make it one of the best places in the country to live. That's unnecessary. Um, when you look at the fact that the property taxes in Kerry are the lowest in the county, um, we don't need to nickel and dime. This town is worth investing in and I, um, I support your budget and probably I would support um, even more of an investment if it were deemed necessary because I don't want this town to suffer. um unnecessarily by trying to penny pinch when it's when it's not actually called for. So, thank you.

Thank you.

There's no additional registered speakers.

If you're in the audience and would like to speak at this public hearing, I couldn't remember where we were. Uh now's your opportunity.

Budget

budget public hearing.

Yeah. Okay.

[clears throat]

Good evening. My name is Dennis Taylor. I live over in Lock Mirror. This is the first time I've ever been in front of council. First time. I don't like to talk in front of people. So, but last year when I got my tax bill, I was shocked. Um, I'm not here to support an increase. I'm actually here to support a decrease. Last year, my property value went up 61%. Okay. My tax bill went up

[sighs] 52%. Just for the town of Kerry. Thank goodness Wake County had the guts to not take that entire amount of value increase and smack me with it. My overall tax bill only went up 35%. Now I ask all of you and people have talked about budgets. How do you expect us senior citizens who we've just sat through this long meeting of senior citizens needing help? We've had individuals saying senior citizens need help. We can't afford this type of increase. I worked for a city. Have you guys ever heard of zerobased budgeting? Do you even know what that is? It's where you sit back and you say, "What's the absolute minimum that we can provide?" And then you step up from there, whether you have three steps, five steps, whatever it is, and you say, "This is the level of service we need to provide in this area." And maybe there's some places where you cut back and maybe there's some places where you have to fund additionally, but we cannot as senior citizens take this. Now, you want to give me another 10% increase or 375 or whatever it works to be. I don't know. And I didn't understand the math she had up there. She swed 3.75 and then said, "I thought I read 37.75 was going to be the millage rate or the carry rate, but I thought mine went from 345 and no thank you. Last year you reduced it by 2%." The amount that you charge per $100, you went from 345 to 325.

Okay. Now I'm seeing I saw one thing that said 3775 or 37 and a quarter. you know, we can't keep absorbing this. And I know that you're not in charge of the state legislature. And Lord, I am so pleased that they are going to show or at least try to limit the amount of increase that you guys can pass down on us. And it's not just the city council, it's also the county where we get taxes from. But to show that type of an increase is really, really tough for us. You've got to look at your fund accounting and look at the various pieces where you're funding this stuff from. And if we need to have other things other than the general fund, then by golly, pass those and pass those on to the people that are using it. I'm a big believer in user fees. You know, you got, you know, you got your enterprise funds and I don't think we have any golf courses, but maybe we do. You know, we don't have a marina or whatever. I came from Florida and um when I moved up here 23 years ago, all I would say is that and not all but in Florida we passed a law called the Save Our Homes Act. And I don't know if anybody's ever heard of this or not, but what they did was they limited the amount of increase that cities, counties could increase your taxes to the CPI, and it might even been twothirds of the CPI. and it limited what you guys could increase it for us homeowners. Hey, you want to tax the people that own businesses, you want to tax people that have got apartment buildings, tax the snot out of them. I don't care. Have a great time. But for us people that are trying to pay for our

home and I don't want to lose my house to taxes and I really truly am afraid of that here in Kerry and I know we have a 5% limit. if you got really low income and if you looked at that it's 45 grand that's you know that's a lot of taxes even for somebody that's making 45 grand. So I just ask you to really consider zerobased budgeting and look at what it is you're increasing us to. So thank you very much for your time and appreciate it and look forward to the next meeting.

Thank you. Anyone else to speak at this public hearing? Seeing no one will close the public hearing. Our next budget public hearing is June 11th. Is that correct?

Yes, that's correct.

Okay. Council members, questions, comments, thoughts,

Stacy, maybe you want to clarify for Mr. Taylor, the 3.75 cents is what's being recommended this year in addition to what is our current fiscal year 26 rate of 34 cents. So we are currently at 34 cents.

The recommended budget is at an additional 3.75 cents to bring us to 37.75.

You're exactly right. Council member Richards. Yes.

And the council continues to meet and go over.

Yes. And that that is the recommended amount.

That's what I was going to say.

And you know what? Before I stop speaking, I'll just put in the plug if anybody is still watching with us tonight or perhaps streaming at a more decent hour in the future uh and feeling that maybe tonight's presentation uh didn't supply enough information, I would just encourage you to find the many many many previous conversations that council has had and the staff presentations we've received going back as far as January. And I would draw your attention in particular to our council retreat in February and the work sessions of this week in particular. So

for folks craving more slide decks, more conversations, uh you can find us on our YouTube channel. We have that on Facebook as well. What other venues am I missing?

Cary TV.

Kyrie TV. Yes.

Yes.

Yeah. I I'm glad you said that because I was just thinking for anyone watching, they might say, "Wow, that was a really quick presentation for 350 pages of detail

which is also online." So you can go

which is also online.

You can read the full document as well.

Exactly. Okay. And I would also say that there's a really great presentation by um Dana Whitmar who gave a a lovely presentation at our op our budget openhouse um which so if you want the uh too long didn't read version I think it's seven minutes or maybe a little bit more of her presentation that's on our YouTube right

and that's also on the YouTube station. So you can look up um our uh budget openhouse is what you would search on. So,

and I'll share something in between a TLDDR 7 minute video [snorts] and reading hundreds of page of budget. Um, I would highly recommend if you're you're curious as to what we're trying to do to limit the increase as much as we can. Um, and what we're discussing as potential ways to shave. Um, check out the recording of the, uh, work session that we did just prior to this. We have been doing this since 5:00 PM. That's why we all look a little haggarded. No, I'm kidding. We look a little tired. Uh, but that that conversation, we covered several topics in the hour 10 minutes or so we were talking, but I think we spent a really constructive half an hour. Um, staff Stacy did a great job of bringing forward some potential things that we could reduce. Um, it's really at this point, I feel like this is a significant shift to a values conversation at this point. Um it's it's as much about dollars and cents as it is values. And we added a work session uh to try to get

this work done this previous Tuesday. So there are two this week that I think are worth reviewing if you really want to get a a better picture. Uh the one on Tuesday I think that's we only really got to half of of what we wanted to discuss and it spilled over into today. Um that really is if you're wondering especially individual council members where we agree, disagree, and what we're positing. Those are probably the best things to review in my opinion. And I do have a couple questions, but I'll let you all

please.

Okay. Um, well, one thing I did want to share, this isn't a question, it's a the percentage increase. Um, I I got two emails, two different constituents pointed out that we expressed the the increases in say the utility base rate as a percentage increase, but we don't do that for our tax rate. Um, and I think it would make sense for us to start doing that just so it doesn't So, so we're when when we're talking about the numbers, we're always talking about them in the same way. And I think the the percentage it does give relativity. So, I thought perhaps that's just something that we could adopt as a habit. It it does make a little bit of sense to me why that would look strange that we say it one way. Um, I know it's not an intent to offiscate and I did respond that way, but just a just an observation. Um, and I wanna I want to ask make sure I understand and I I should have asked this previously, but does this budget in staff's opinion reflect a continuation of our critical maintenance investment level or is this more robust when it comes to maintenance? I had that written down already and then um I was surprised to hear somebody speaking specifically to maintenance. Um, but I I'd really like to have a better understanding of where we are. I know we discussed in one of our work sessions at length uh our investment in resurfacing the mayor's favorite topic I think. Uh, but I was just wondering generally how

would we we would categorize the level of investment we're doing in maintenance because since you uh picked up on street resurfacing, we're losing ground in street resurfacing over the past two years and we skipped a year in the last three years.

Um, I believe we're losing ground in sidewalk maintenance. Um, I I want to believe and Stacy can add as well. Um it it the answer is probably it depends because there's probably some pa some places where you're keeping pace and there's some places where you're losing ground. Um if you want us to summarize more, happy to do that as we

would you call this critical maintenance again this year or is there an uptick in the investment?

Well, and the critical maintenance is what I'd say it's maintenance focused. It's less expansion focus. And certainly for those that have been doing budget for longer, you may remember the days of where we were able to do more um do all of the critical maintenance and do expansion. over the past several years, it certainly um we stopped doing as much expansion. Certainly try to focus on critical maintenance, but I feel like we're losing ground on uh critical maintenance infrastructure. Uh senior um our our um rec centers, our senior center are aging. Um our storm water systems as we were talking about earlier today are aging. Everything that you have in carry is getting older and requires more money and more frequent uh maintenance cost. I think that's what we're feeling overall. I think we could statistically look at data and get you better information than just what I'm saying.

Your opinion would be fine with me, but when I hear critical maintenance, and this is my, like I said, just shy of four years on council, critical maintenance to me means we have to do this or we're going to get sinkholes and things are going to fall apart. And and what I'm what I what I want to understand is are we and are we doing proactive maintenance or not really at this at this budget level.

I'll let you add as well.

I think it depends on certain areas. So I would echo exactly what uh Russ has

indicated. I will say this budget has more maintenance money in it than the prior year budget. Um, so that's a movement in the right direction, but it absolutely does not fulfill the full need when you look at all of our facilities out there and what they really could stand in order to keep pace with probably what most expectations are. So, we are moving in the right direction, but I don't not want anyone to think that this is gosh, everything's great and everything's up to snuff from a maintenance perspective. It's a move in the right direction

and that delay adds cost.

Right.

Right. One of the I've read enough books to know that is you know delayed maintenance is more expensive maintenance. Um

and we feel the pressures of um consumer price index and price increases as well um as I know residents do.

Yeah. Uh one additional question um in light of the really compelling uh public speaks out about the total life center. I'm curious, what are we are we investing public dollars in Total Life Center or is that self-funding? I'm I'm embarrassed that I don't know that

it's not self-unding.

It is not the to So, you're speaking specifically of the Total Life Center located at Bond Park off of High House Road.

Correct.

Um my understanding of that facility, Russ, correct me because this was very early in my career here. My understanding is that the town built that facility, but it is managed by a private entity.

Same.

I thought so. Okay. It is it subsidized by taxpayer dollars?

It is not. We do not have an item in our budget that's for the total life center. We do have funding in the budget for the senior center senior center which is carry constructed carry operated.

Okay. Thank you. My my experience asking at Relias my women's leadership group volunteered there a couple years in a row. It's sort of an annual service project and I had made the assumption that we were funding it and then I realized I've never seen it in a budget.

Correct. So, okay. So, it's a nonprofit,

correct?

Got it. Thank you. Um, and

I think that's all of my questions. I don't want to make I don't want to repeat everything that was said in the work session because we'll be here till 2 a.m.

I agree. Um, I don't want to go too deep into anything, but I just want some speakers here who came forward to share what their thoughts are. Some supported this, some asked for more money, some shared, you know, struggles. And please know that you know we hear you. Your your voices are being heard. Um like our colleagues my colleagues have mentioned there are so many different ways of you um getting the information. Please watch the work sessions where we have in fact added more work sessions to go deeper into these conversations. This year council is spending phenomenal amount of time. Um, we started today at 5:00 pm and we're still going and I think it will again take two more hours to finish this meeting, but we're committed and we're here and we're not giving up. Um, I want you to know um, thank you for sharing your your challenges and being vulnerable here. I can tell you from my perspective, I feel the burden and the pressure of making this decision and um we are taking every single decision very very carefully and with lot of digging in and lot of questions and we understand the challenges of increasing taxes and generally inflation that's hitting every home hard in America and Kerry is no different. So that's why the council is working extremely hard and we will continue to do that and in the end you may not find everything to be accurate or 100% in line with what you want us to do but we are trying our best and we will continue to do that to make sure that the residents of Kerry you know have the best services

and best staff facilities and we'll try our best to keep the taxes as low as possible.

I'll be super quick just to to say that it it's a restatement, but um as costs are going up for the people in the community, costs are going up for Carrie also, which makes it particularly difficult when we want to keep taxes as low as possible. But I hear as many people, not just tonight, but in the emails I get in the conversations I have in the community asking for us to invest more. I get as many of those conversations as I do asking for us to make cuts. So, it's not a clear-cut direction based on community feedback.

Well said. Yeah. And I do think it's important that um as you both mentioned and for everyone who's watching to realize we're not just looking at cuts. We're not just looking at ways to recover investment, but we're also looking for ways to find new revenue opportunities. A lot of great ideas have been shared and you know getting more for our recovery from services we provide to other municipalities to sponsorships to you know looking at everything from u parking to other sorts of ideas. So as people are watching they're probably thinking oh all you're doing is cutting cutting cutting. No we're looking for other ways that we can find money uh to help offset the cost. One thing I think is worth clarifying as well. I know a lot of the online conversations and and in our one of our both of our last two, well not today but our earlier um work session, we discussed um a fund balance transfer. Uh typically there's a fund balance transfer as part of the the budget. Um there is projections uh for us to

potentially have enough money in our we'll call it a reserve fund but it's an excess balance above what is necessary uh to be maintained for policy that we could tap into to potentially you know right now limit the tax increase uh a a little bit but also potentially have some projects that we put on the back burner and make those okay we will do these if we have if the trends remain what they are. But one thing I want to clarify, I had a couple of people reach out to me. I don't get Facebook messages very often, but this one triggered a few Facebook messages. This is not money. We do not have $44 million sitting in the bank that we're just sitting on right now. We absolutely do not have that money in the bank today. That is a projection which likely in the fall we could potentially if spending and revenues remain uh similar to how they are today. staff has estimated that it is potentially going to be what our account balance is come fall. Um there's we we asked staff about it. They're they're here now. They they said, "Hey, it depends on how riskaverse you are." Um but one thing I would like staff to consider doing for us is to investigate. What I what I want to understand thoroughly is can we can we count on that money without violating our own reserve policy? Um, it's a projection. It's not money in the bank. And when I was thinking about it, it's anecdotally to me, it's very much like I plan to pay off my car with money in my savings um midsummer, but then I had vet bills and a family member needed money for a utility bill and I spent it down some. So, now it's going to be October, November or December. Um, and that's based off of a projection of what I'll have in my savings account. Now, I'm still planning to do it. Um, but I'm I do know that that's a kind of a moving target as to when and this was inspired by one of the comments that you made where you're like, hey, you know, I'm

trying to look at this realistically. I'd like to understand though, is it a viable option for us to say, hey, you know what? Let's budget that, you know, in a way that we're going to be able to tap into what this projected amount is. and we count count on that without violating our reserve policy. I'd like to understand that better. Um what and what are the repercussions if we do dip below

Well, I think I mean just to step back a bit, staff has already identified 16 million in this FY27 budget um uh to be used as part of this budget from fund balance,

right?

From the general fund. from the general sorry from the general fund that would normally go into fund balance at the end of the

That's correct. That's correct.

Correct.

Yes, that's correct.

So the the projections of of what we currently um are what you're currently projecting that are in the quarterly reports. How I guess part of it is how confident do you feel in those projections?

How much does it rely on sales tax revenue coming in at a certain level consistently? Yeah, it must be you must have some sort of reliance if you've already determined that some 16 million of that could could be moved over. The question is I I don't know. I hate to say it this way, but how low can you go? How close can you get to 33 and a3% understanding that these are projections? That would be really good information because the last quarterly report said we're on target for I think 125 million um at the end of the fiscal year.

Well, I like that you uh someone mentioned kind of ramifications or you know qualifications because it is something we want to talk to the bond rating a you know our rating agents about. [clears throat] um you need to know what it means um not to just be at fund balance but to carry some amount of money in your savings account. We'll keep going with that analogy because

it's a good one and it is only one time uh money to be spent.

Um that may not be understood but you can't use it for ongoing operating expenses. Um, so we are probably the best way to say it is uh doing a lot of math especially Dana Whitmar over there and we'd like to bring that back to you at a upcoming work session if that'd be okay.

That would be my suggestion.

Yeah, let's carry this.

Yeah, I think what we're giving here is giving you all here is all the questions we will ask when you bring them up.

Yes. Yeah.

And this is kind of summarizing what we have already discussed

so that you know in future sessions we can kind of come up with a better

absolutely

suggestion. And I think when we we post a balance a fund balance like that we should put projected

next to it so that just to make it absolutely clear the first couple of times I saw I thought that was the fund balance. It wasn't until I went,

"Oh, that's that's the that's after all the receipts are in for the fiscal year." So, um I think that also would help with clarification just also for us that are newer. We're not old hat at this yet. Um and I'm not calling anybody

old.

We [laughter] hate we're not seasoned all of us at the sh. So, that that would be helpful. staff would do some um number crunching and more math please. That would be really helpful just so that we can especially as the the conversation as we have it with residents too so they understand that we fully explored it.

Absolutely we can do that. No problem. The feedback's very helpful. Thank you.

Bella, do you want to say something? So um I think you guys my colleagues already um shared a lot of information and if you go to the YouTube or just check our work session but one thing I want to mention is uh this year bring uh council member Richards and council member Benel we went to the UNCC uh school of government and also with our interim town manager. Uh what I still

remember that public safety is not required by by the town and I've heard so many times mayor mentioned we want to keep our high level service which means we need to provide a high level of public safety and we u that's already mentioned so so many time in the past five to 10 years we haven't invested enough in public safety and this not the town's like um mandatory responsibility to provide this high level of service like you call 911 the police officer will show up in a few minutes that's not required but Kerry is such a great place because we provide the high level of service which means we use our property tax to invest in the police and fire and especially for West Kerry uh uh council member um Vanso She uh she mentioned a lot of lot of uh capital investment and infrastructure because I totally understand because it's growing fast and the new fire stations because we have seen that if we don't keep that level of service or be proactive investment will see the crack service in West Carry. So that's why we have so many added work sessions discussing our budget. It's not a decided number of increase, but we're still working on it. We are trying give a lot of pressure to our staff to lower. So, you'll see a lot of

better numbers.

Give us lower numbers, but still give us what we want, right? Like you give your kid uh $20, just go

Yeah.

find everything we need.

Thank you for bringing up the public safety aspect and the investment in this budget because I think that's important. And if anybody is interested in hearing the wise from both our chief of police and our fire chief, it's in our

quarterly meeting recording on YouTube. Just fast forward to you see people in uniform. And then they explain better than I would be able to summarize uh why that investment despite us having exceptional first responder service today um we have neglected to invest in the last few years because not neglected that's not the right word. We've not been able to fully invest, I think, the way we need to to keep us the safest place and and and [clears throat] that critical maintenance is really one of the key reasons why. And it's time for us to make sure that we don't mess up something really good.

And also I I learned that some rural areas the police and fires all volunteers. So I don't think car residents want volunteer police officers.

Maybe they do. I don't know if anybody wants to be a volunteer firefighter, send me an email um and we can talk about it.

Anything else?

Thank you, Miss TG.

Thank you very much.

We'll now move to discussion items 24Z14 Weston PDD amendment and I track four. Aaron Pucket will give a report. We'll hear from the planning. We're we will hear the planning board's recommendation and council may take action. Miss Pucket.

Thank you. And hello again. This is a request to reszone approximately 8.7 acres, excuse me, [clears throat] at 701 Weston Parkway. You held a public hearing for this request in September of last year. And this item is on discussion tonight given the level of interest in the resoning request and that the fact that it represents the first redevelopment opportunity in Weston and council may take action this evening. As a reminder, the site is located at the intersection of Weston Parkway and Norwell Boulevard. There are existing offices to the north, east, and west, and detached dwellings to the south, including the Beexley subdivision, which directly abuts the site. There is an existing office building and associated

surface parking on the site, which was constructed in the 1990s. The proposed development of the site includes up to 275 multif family dwelling units and a minimum of 1500 and maximum of 5,000 square feet of non-residential area vertically integrated into the building or buildings. The non-residential square footage could consist of retail, personal service, or restaurant uses. [clears throat] Buildings in this principal use building envelope, which is shown in the hashing there, will be a maximum of 75 feet in height and five stories. Accessory buildings may be located outside of that hashed envelope on the western portion of the site and maybe up to one story and 20 ft in height. Within the principal building envelope, the applicant will reduce the footprint of the building if a modification to the LDO connectivity requirements is granted at time of development plan. In that case, no building may be located within the double cross-hatched area representing an additional 25- foot setback for the principal building. However, a 70 foot 75 foot wide projection of the building may still be located in this area shown in purple. The proposal also includes 50 foot type A streetscapes along both site premigages and this is consistent with the LDO requirement for a residential project. A 15-oot type-C buffer is proposed along the west. We're adjacent to western common area and for a short portion of the southern boundary adjacent to the widest part of the adjoining neighborhood's open space. [clears throat] The remainder of the southern buffer will be 30 to 45 ft in width and planted to a type A rate. An additional evergreen screen is proposed outside of that buffer in the area overlaid with the green hashing here, which will consist of a row of shade tolerant evergreen plantings that achieve at least 10 ft in height at maturity and space closely together. At this time, the specific location of that

screen is not identified, but it must be between the southern buffer and the principal building. So it may be located anywhere within that hash green area, but parking, drive aisles, streets, and similar improvements may also be located in that area. Buildings may not be located in the green cross-hatched area. The proposed development also includes 12 foot wide side paths along each site frontage. There's that word again. This is more than was required under the original Western PDD, but is consistent with recently updated national guidance and again the forthcoming move and engage chapter updates. The applicant has written an option to narrow the facility to 8 feet if needed to meet other LDO or PDD requirements that would create conflicts with locating that trail within the streetscape. and a private greenway connection will be built internal to the site to connect to the western property line which could allow for a future connection into the larger greenway network nearby. Additional development standards include a minimum of 5% of the units offered at a rent affordable at 80% of the area median income or AMI for a period of 30 years. A minimum of 3,000 square feet of community gathering space, more than double the LDO requirement. The gathering area will be amenitized and a pick list of options is proposed. A minimum of 5% of the parking spaces will include EV charging capabilities and an an additional 5% of spaces will be constructed with conduit for possible future EV charging. And architectural commitments include increased masonry on building facades facing streets, a prohibition on vinyl siding, and variation in the building roof line. The applicant made a number of changes to the proposal following the public hearing prior to the planning and zoning board's consideration of the request, including removing town houses as a permitted use. Therefore, pod 2 was removed from the PDD.

Neighborhood recreation was removed from counting toward the commercial square footage, and this better ensures some actual non-residential uses will be incorporated on the site. The PDD was revised to specify the mixeduse or multif family buildings will be located in that northern portion of the site within 400 ft of both Weston Parkway and Norwell Boulevard. That was the area represented by the principal use building envelope that was just discussed. A six-foot fence within the southern perimeter buffer was replaced with the aforementioned evergreen screen. It will consist of shade tolerant plantings with the location to be determined at development plan, but it will extend for at least 450 linear feet from Norwell Boulevard. The width of the multi-use side path along the site frontage was increased from 8 feet to 12 feet with again that caveat that it may be reduced to 8 feet in certain locations if there are conflicts with other requirements. And the workforce housing condition was updated to a time frame of 30 years. It was 20 years at public hearing. The planning and zoning board reviewed this request at their March meeting. Board members had generally positive comments that acknowledged the challenge with new office uses and noted multif family could be a reasonable transition. They noted the importance of enhanced multimodal facilities and specifically noted the alignment with live chapter policies and the board unanimously found the request consistent with the imaginary community plan. The applicant did make several changes to the proposal following the planning and zoning board meeting, including amending the building envelope to be modestly reduced if a modification to street connectivity is granted at development plan. Revising the community gathering area condition to locate at least 2800 square feet within that principal use building envelope. committing to amenities at two area bus stops and increasing the accessory

building setback to ensure BU buildings are fully outside of that potential evergreen screen area. The full staff analysis against the imaginary community plan was provided in your staff report, but I'll summarize staff's findings here. Staff found the proposal met most applicable live policies. Similarly, the site presents a unique redevelopment opportunity which helps meet shape policies and vegetated buffers will help facilitate transitions. Stronger non-residentidential commitment could more clearly meet the mixeduse policy and town houses would have helped with use informed transitions. Side path along both site frontages addresses move chapter policies and enriched policies are addressed with substantial southern buffers and electric vehicle charging infrastructure. Overall, staff found many plan policies were either addressed or at least partially addressed and therefore we recommend approval.

This concludes my presentation and I'm happy to answer questions.

Okay. Thank you. It's a lot and a lot has gone on since the public hearing. I'm going to give my comments and then I'm going to open up to my colleagues because I'm waffling for and against so you can change my mind. I'm just going to go over things I think that are pros and cons to me. Um, I think the applicant did a decent job with the aesthetics by moving the structure toward Weston. Uh, traffic I view in a different way. Uh, even though there are less trips than an office building, the trips are similar. So that means a worse environment for the residents. That is when I go to work, they go to work. When I come home, they come home. When I'm home on the weekend, they're home on the weekend. Whereas office is a good neighbor because they're at work and on the weekends they're not there even though they generate more trips. So that's how I

view that. You can say that's crazy or not, but that's how I view that. Um the the affordable units, I'm going to speak every time I see this now. Uh 5% of 80% AMI means I have to make $108,000 a year. That's not workforce to me. I'd rather see 2% at 40% AMI than 5% at 80% AMI. That's just me. So to me, that's a negative because you're just taking away from the value of what the structure could be. You're really not providing workforce housing. Future uses. I had a great conversation with council member Richards and we talked this through and it's my opinion and my opinion only that right now you can't build class A offices unless it's in a mixeduse area like Fenton or downtown Kerry. Uh so I don't see in the near future class A office being on this site. Uh and I do see the need for redevelopment. So that means it's going to be res it should be residential. That would probably a be a better use because office parks are dying and we need a mix of use. So I'm looking at residential. So then it comes down to and again this is just me. Uh do I want the fivetory or do I want town homes? Well the thing about town homes to make that business model work again I don't have data. I'm guessing means you have to shove a lot of town homes in that area and so you won't get that distance separation. So, I'm not really sure about the town homes. So, that's where I'm stuck. I'm right in the middle of everything. Pros and cons. Uh, I could go either way, but those are the pros and cons I see. And I'm dying to hear what everybody else has.

You're 495.

Oh, yeah.

Jack's still he's still sitting at the table.

[laughter]

Well, I'll weigh in as well that the

first thing I want to say is although this is a resoning and I think I said it when it first came, it's really more like a redevelopment, it's a it's a change. It's a get rid of this and build something else. A lot of the resonings that come here are on Greenfield land and we're trying to figure out what it is. It's really a redevelopment. Now, that doesn't mean it's a bad thing. It just it's something that I think I have to put a different set of questions and hat on. Um, but by the way, I love it. I love that it's a redevelopment because it's an empty office building and having a reuse opportunity is is so great. Um, what I struggle with because it is a good project. Um, and the applicant has made so many changes by listening to the thoughtful and engaging um, residents. They moved community spaces, moved accessory buildings, they added plantings. They've done a great job in outreach, even so far as going and creating a website that, you know, to be more transparent. It's a great model by looking at it today and what it was before. It's a great model to show that things can get better over time. That's great. But I'm still on the 4951 as well. and um because I'm I'm still torn, but I'm leaning against it. And I'll say why because it's for me it's missing some things. And it's not all on the applicant. I want to say that it's not on the applicant. I wish we had the Western Corridor [clears throat] study that would help guide what this is going to look like. We always have those kinds of imagine carry documents, etc. that help guide us to what we want this area to look like. Because if you get on Evans Road and you go down into Morrisville, it is thousands and thousands of apartments on five or six corners. And I don't think that's what we want in

Carrie, but I don't know what that's going to look like. I also find that an area such as this that already has single family homes there, it could benefit from some transition. Um, I didn't mind it and and um the applicant knows that I didn't mind the and in fact I like the town homes being a transition from single family homes to um large apartment building. It's what we're doing we doing in West Kerry. I think that transition is really important. Um the housing diversity of having there's not a lot of town homes in that area. that housing diversity would have been better as well. And that transition because there is none, I think also sets a precedent that I'm not necessarily sure is right. Where I live, I live in an urban framework. I have a single family house. There's duplexes across from me. There's a big multif family on the corner. I expect that. I know that. I bought into it. These residents didn't necessarily expect that. They certainly they expected that the office building would stay there. Um and then finally my last one is that um an apartment buildings that have been built over time in Kerry have all over the last five years I would say all have had structured parking. There's a lot of value to structured parking right but I know that there are some great shade trees in the current parking lot. Um, but that area, I would have rather seen structured parking and repurposing that lot that has some mature trees into a more environmentally friendly um, area that could do much more for storm water. Um, I would have rather seen that. Um, I understand it's more expensive, but keeping that conventional parking lot there and the additional impervious surface is not where we've been headed from an environmental

perspective. So, again, I'm interested in hearing what what my council colleagues say, but but right now I'm really leaning towards um denying.

Who's next?

I have opinions.

I think this is Michelle's. Would you like to go next?

You'll still have opinions and opinions. [laughter]

And questions.

So, I do I am going to change the order of what I plan to say based on what's already been said if I can find it in my notes. [snorts] Um, this is this project has really changed my thinking about challenge the way I think about transitions. I mean, on my two and a half years on council, I've learned from my colleagues and hear you all talk about transitions being so important. I and hear residents talking about transitions and so that naturally seemed to mean that possibly town homes would be better. However, with this the changes that have been made to the proposal, seeing them move the proposed new building all the way into the current footprint. I mean, it's it's slightly out, but it they've done a really good job. And it's by definition of transition. There's no transition. But I believe this may be better. So it's challenging kind of the way, again, maybe we don't always do things the way we've done them just because. And there's going to be times where I would maybe feel differently, but I I think that the changes that I've made here made this um makes this more positive. So, what I actually plan to say um was just that in in the last

week, I've gone back. I've talked to the applicant again. I've talked to a resident. I went back and read all of the emails. I searched for all the keywords, the people I remember talking to, reread all of the emails from everyone, noted when they emailed me, the last contacts that I've had, what the feedback that I've gotten since the last changes have been favorable. I have heard no new concerns. I have heard no negative feedback since the last changes have been made. One thing that stood out to me about this redevelopment redevelopment um reszoning versus others is that so many times like I you know I think either the applicant's going to be happy or the residents are going to be happy but at this for this the residents wanted all different things and like I kind of knew that before but when I went back and reread all the emails like back to back. Um, you know, some of them are were not going to be happy if they were apartments at all. Some wanted the building back as far as possible from the neighborhood. Some said only town homes would be acceptable. Some were only worried about traffic. Some one actually said a commercial building would always be more acceptable to an oversized multif family development. And you know, just thinking about what by right they can build. It's a 75 foot building and it could be much bigger than what it is now and it can be much closer. And so many many times over the last however long we've been working on this, I've driven down Juliet Circle and

I've driven through. At first I'm not very good with directionality. At first I was like, what's that big building? So that's center green that's near there that you can see. And that's kind of what they would be able to see if if by right they were building more, you know, class A office buildings and perhaps the timing is not right. But whether we pause and things become right in the next couple of years and we go back to it again, that was a thing that I took a lot of consideration for was in the long run, what is best for this area. looking at the resident feedback and it made it more difficult. I mean like there's not you can't side with the applicant or the residents when the residents didn't seem to want um all the same things. So and and I don't believe keeping it like it is is the viable option which was the only thing the residents agreed on is that we could just keep it like it is. And um so with the recent changes um I I believe uh of course there's still no perfect plan. There were there were things that I would like to see different. Um I noted it's very interesting. I've never heard any of us say before I'd rather have 2% affordable units at a lower

AMI. But that's

Yeah,

that would make a difference. You've come a long way [laughter] in my time.

Yeah. The 80% really doesn't make a difference to me.

Yes.

But the 40% now you're talking.

You hit the nail on the head.

But I mean, these are all great things for us to continue. Um I um again, it's it's not perfect. I appreciate so much and I think what has happened with this reasonzoning with the compromise and talking with the

residents and going out and visiting the site and seeing it from resident perspective that the applicant did. I think it made a huge difference. And um I think one of the things that is significantly different than we when we last sat here and talked about it was specificity

and we had no one come out and speak tonight. I hope that is a positive thing. The fact that I haven't gotten any more any additional negative emails. I hope that specificity and I hope the time that the applicant put in working with the neighbors to make it the best possible scenario for everything um worked out. Um but

that's a really good point by the way. I I'm really glad you mentioned that last one because I hadn't really thought about that and that's why I love hearing everybody's conversation. I only got two emails and both were in support. Even though I also got the old petition of that that was signed in December and January by close to 500 residents who were against it,

right?

There's someone from Paris on that list.

Yeah, there's there's a lot of that's on my questions. Yeah, I was looking up the addresses and counting them and yeah, pulling some in and out. But that's a really good point that I hadn't thought of because we take citizen input um to mean so much to us and the fact that they're we didn't even receive an email is the easiest, the lowest entry, lowest barrier and that I hadn't thought about that. So I appreciate you bringing that up.

Some of them have my phone number so I was waiting.

Me too. I actually reached out to three of them.

Well, I'll share. I think Michelle really summed it up very well. Um, this project is significantly different. I'll be honest, at first I was like, I don't

know. Um, it's so significantly different, but it's been changed to address especially the immediate abuing neighbors concerns and which were unique concerns. And my jaw dropped when I got an email saying, "Okay, I'm okay with this now." And I I was like, "Oh, well, we got there." Because honestly, I just hammered at that stupid fence. You know, we're not really going to put in that giant fence that does nothing, right? Um, so I wanted to share a few things. First and foremost, the presentation, the summary of the changes since the public hearing and the changes since planning and zoning. just what I was hoping for in every presentation. I don't know. I think you you've always done the changes since public hear or since planning and zoning, right? And then the

We usually do both, but I sometimes do lump them together. This one changed so much after the public hearing that we felt like we need to break those apart.

That was so well done and it really does show how much time and energy

the neighbors put into giving feedback and negotiating. They went didn't just cross their arms and dig in their heels and say absolutely nothing. They they really worked with the applicant and the applicant was very receptive and went back and forth. Um that that really makes all the difference in the world. I will share that I am completely satisfied with the exceptional buffer composed of evergreens and conifers and and the sheer distance having also gone out there driven around taken a look. Um, I really feel as though, especially having met with the residents frequently, they would they're going to be much happier with a nearly translucent buffer than town homes right behind them. So, I think that's a better transition than what we typically, you said it well,

not how we typically,

not how we typically define it. Um, so I I really feel good about that. I want to

commend them for removing accessory buildings. Yes.

Um from that same area [clears throat] because I know I expressed a concern that you know if there if there's people I don't know if there's storage areas or trash or anything like that that could have been particularly disruptive and want to commend you for removing that. Um and particularly Mr. Bowers, he was he was really helpful because what I appreciated about him is he he sort of answered my dumb questions, right? So I got a better perspective of what it's like in that community. Um, and I I wrote down here that Mr. Milato nailed it when he said zoning conditions are better than trust. That's my new that's going to be in my head pretty much forever and ever. I feel as though

he's nodding out there.

Is he still here?

Yeah,

I was I wasn't trying to be a kissup. It really was. I said [laughter] I said that's absolutely true because often times what we what we we're fighting against isn't just people not wanting change right in their backyard. We're fighting against what it what they would love it to be or an alternative version of it. But I think what we've always got to be conscious of is this is the plan in front of us and what they're willing to do and the next plan could be it could be the giant

center

but it's not going to be because these office parks. Yeah, these office and I'll share that. I've shared it before. Uh class A becoming class B right in your backyard. You don't want that either. Um office parks need to adapt to stay being viable. And our commercial properties, our office parks in particular are one of my biggest sort of worries. It's it's unpredictable and

that whole corridor is office. those corridors. So for for those of you that we're not looking to do the same thing everywhere. So we don't have any kind of comprehensive plan for how we're going to address that. But I think we do as a

body need to discuss what would be potential redevelopments or reuse or something so we can address um swiftly if we start having really high rates of of no occupants in these office buildings. so that we're we're not in a pickle.

Both Regency and Weston deserve their own corridor study.

I agree. And we're getting a Weston corridor study.

It's not on the budget.

It's not,

isn't it? The Weston corridor study. I didn't see it as a line item in the budget.

Want to give up?

So, the special planning area might be what you're speaking of. We had the study that was completed a year, year and a half ago, something like that. The multimodal.

The multimodal, right?

Yes. So we do have um in fact I've got a slide it's very high level because the schedule is um very high level but

since you asked but

since you asked

transportation

um so this is our current very high level plan that we would hopefully be bringing some sort of draft special planning area or at least initial sort of feedback on that to in some sort of work session potentially later this year and then focusing on public outreach in the coming year. Um, and then looking for consideration of a special planning area in the future.

So, it's it's bigger than the multimodal, right? Because I didn't see it as a line item budget off. You all looked at it at a work session a year or so ago.

It's a website,

right? So, there there'll be more according to this timeline

coming.

Okay. Coming hopefully later this year.

We need one for Regency, too.

Sorry. Go ahead.

Finish that. And that's why I'm in favor of the project. But

I can go next maybe. Um I think I'm not trying to influence the 4951 but I hope that you know I can just share what I feel. Um I've met the applicant the residents multiple times and this is another one where people have been very civil and residents have

been you know very engaged and every um every feedback every comment that we have received or any information that we receive from them about their challenges and their issues have only made this project better in my view. this has evolved um and I have to give um credit to the entire council because I have also learned from all the council members like sometimes you know I'm thinking about oh I have to talk about affordability and then I forget because there's so much to cover and you know there's like obviously we at 11 p.m. home. So, um, but the comment about affordability is very important. I don't see these projects necessarily as affordable units. Um, they're expensive and you know, anything that we can do to compensate, I think that's a positive step forward. But not to take away from the applicant and the uh residents the engagement has been pretty impeccable and you know the the product that you have or pres the project that you're presenting today it's by no means perfect but you know it's um it's a good project. I would ask Heather one of the things that we covered in the meeting and I for the benefit of this discussion we're talking about transitions and transitions are very important to me as well and one of the residents said I would have preferred town homes over buffer right and we have different opinions and decisions uh or sorry uh opinions on this matter but Heather you mentioned something very important in that meeting that this buffer is also considered a transition from our point of view, right?

Do do you want me to speak?

Yeah, please go ahead. Please go ahead.

Yes. So, the the Kerry community plan talks about multiple strategies. You can make transitions, use form, buffers, and other vegetation can also be um a type of buffer.

So, so this is a kind of a transition. We don't necessarily need a town home to build that transition up.

Yes,

this is a pretty big buffer,

right? The transition can be can be made in a number of ways and we often see projects choose multiple ways but yes absolutely large buffers can help with transitions.

Thank you so much. Um there's another thing that you know um the applicant shared with us or shared with me and Heather while we were in the meeting with them that you know there is um they don't have to listen to the residents. They don't have to go by what people are telling them. Um they're already zoned to build three buildings which is high density without any council's approval. But they are willing to work with the council and the residents to come up with a plan that is going to be the best at least from their perspective in this ecosystem and will best serve the residents. Is that correct? Um I know you guys also did the balloon test and there was some feedback and you kind of adjusted and pushed the building. Um, so what I'm trying to get to is like, you know, there was a lot of homework and background that was done by council members, by the applicant, by the residents, and none of the residents who were actually sending us emails or sending me emails before um in opposition to this project have um shed any disappointment. They were actually very happy that you know Kain is going to be the builder and the pro the product is going to be a good product for that area. I agree we need a vision for that area but um I'm kind of leaning towards supporting this only because of what I see as a possibility that it will offer for not only the residents for this community but then for people who are like next door um accessibility

being one of them

and retail

and retail that's what yeah

I have thoughts but go first councilmber member Wong.

Oh. Um, just make sure this is this meeting I can finish by an hour and then I can go to the airport and pick up my husband as well [laughter] or he needs to order uh Uber. I'll text him if we [laughter] go as long as possible. Um, uh, I really appreciate uh the residents. Um Chad is not here today and he sent an email kind of um very um acceptable for the current uh plan and I went to Chad's house and see at his backyard and he's on the hilltop and to see everything over there. So the original one is really I can't say yes for the original one and it was last December.

Agreed. Um but um the applicant really made a lot of improvement improvement but I also uh want to uh echo with uh council member uh Kong Johnson that the residents there's no mean residents over there.

Yeah. [laughter]

So

literally invite you into their home.

Yeah. Yeah. And I'm so glad the back

Yeah. the conversation can keep going. But also um Mayor Port Bush said about the corridor study with that I'll be more confident to say yes. But I when I see the timeline is it'll be like at least a year or longer. So but from current situation uh because the resident will be afraid if this passed will will the nearby office buildings are going to be redeveloped the same way and I I think we need to have the cor at that time I think we

should have the corridor study already. So this one is the first one and I'm lean 51% [laughter] to support um because they have done a long time study and work on and especially with the residents uh and their feedback I feel is especially very important for for me and tonight no one show up is also a positive signal [laughter] and even yeah and applicant is staying theater still. Yeah. Thank you.

Okay, I'll wrap us up. Uh I'll start with gratitude again. I think the residents were extraordinarily engaged. They did literally invite us to their homes and I like many of you stood in their backyards and really visualized what this property was going to look like. I think uh in equal measure the applicant was also extraordinarily responsive and so we encouraged in the earlier discussion to have the two parties continue to dialogue and I think this is an example of how something is really shaped for the better when that happens and and works how it's intended to uh you know I want to share my thinking with the so residents understand the vote I'm about to take. So they they know the the lens I'm applying to this decision making. And so I think it's tempting to think that this is sometimes resident versus developer or the property stays exactly the same versus the application. And I don't really think that either framework is how I am actually considering it. I I think I am thinking of it as this is going to change. It's going to change. Can it change in a way that

addresses resident concerns and is satisfying a need for Carrie and is the right fit for the right place? And I think of what I told constituents uh what I told constituents as a candidate how I was going to make decisions. Am I applying that same criteria to this decision? You know, am I being consistent? And so for me, swapping concrete for concrete, a vacant failing office building for homes to people for with homes for people to live in is a swap I would want to make. Um, you know, in thinking about the alternatives for this property, the mayor was an excellent thought partner. We did walk through these scenarios together and I agree. I don't think class A office in considering the current market conditions would be the likely scenario, but considering that that's what could be built there by Wright, I don't think that that's the right swap. As council member Craig also noted, it could be so much closer to the property lines. And I I know that there was a lot of time of day use concerns by the neighbors, but I think that is not the right alternative for me. And then so often when we're considering multifamily, it feels like well perhaps the next most attractive alternative is less density, which in this case would be town homes. And I find myself in the same situation of feeling like in this particular case, town homes to me do not feel like a preferable fit because you would have to build so many. They would be so much closer to the residents property lines. And what I really appreciate about this proposal and something I told constituents I would value when we were making decisions is I would value redevelopment and I would value uh tree

canopy and preservation of green spaces. And I agree uh Mayor Prom Bush. Uh it's it's strange to advocate for a parking lot, but because this parking lot has so many mature trees in it and we have this evergreen buffer, I I think all of that would likely have to go away in a town home scenario. And so again, that is not a preferable swap for me. And so if we're thinking about what the resident's concerns and what their ideal situation was that we can't deliver, which is it stays exactly the same, I actually think this application delivers as close as possible to that promise. I understand commercial to residential is not a onetoone swap, but with all of the conditions and all of the work the applicant has done to push this building as far into the corner as possible to keep it more or less on the current footprint to add in additional green cover. This checks so many boxes for me. Um, it's boxes that again I I told constituents I would be looking for when we had to make these really tough calls. Um, and I think even though it it isn't perfect, that it does ultimately address so many of the resident concerns and I will reiterate as well, I have received the same feedback in recent days that it seems the the neighbors appreciate all the effort that went into this and I have heard favorable feedback. Uh my one last expression of gratitude will be to you again, Council Member Craig. You have been a tireless advocate for your district. Um you have conveyed so much information. You've been the conduit between the applicant, between the neighbors. So, thank you for being so informative.

You're my biggest cheerleader today.

I know.

And my new best friend. [laughter]

And it was just your birthday.

And it was just my birthday. Um, I also

want to express that the residents pointed out how impressed they were by our new council members and how engaged and they were just blown away at the questions that you you asked and how quickly you um, Council Member Wong and Council Member Richard. So, just

What about me? [laughter]

Well, we talked about how you always do that like people expected you to do that.

Michelle, am I new?

I'm sorry. [laughter] I'm getting punchy.

Yeah. Are we ready for a motion?

Yeah.

Anyone do it?

Sweat.

I will. I move that we adopt the following documents attached to the online agenda. Am I reading the right thing? Yes, it's it's late. [snorts] Um that we adopt the following documents attached to the online agenda. the statement of consistency for 24 ra14 and reszoning ordinance 24 ree 14.

There's a motion

second

and a second discussion.

The only thing I'm going to say is the best part of being on this council is hearing everyone's viewpoints in a way in a thoughtful way that I had not considered some of them. And so, um, I actually the last couple of, uh, line items from you, Councilman McCrae, actually, um, swung me back over. So, thank you all for your very, very strong

Well, that's why I always say I will never tell you what I'm going to vote in advance because I don't know. I I I you know I have a a feeling I've I've

lean

I've lean I've leaned more than 51

but I will always listen because I mean there's things that you say here that I haven't thought about before.

And uh also on to I remember uh council member uh Craig also uh talked about that every decision she made she needs to sleep like have a good sleep over it.

Michelle, it's your day.

All right. Thank you so much.

Somebody call the question. Sorry, we'll be here forever.

Yeah, please.

All in favor of the motion, please say I.

I.

And the opposition will be me. Voted six to one. Thank you so much. Thank you for the team that all y'all went through.

All y'all,

all of y'all. All right, we're moving to the second discussion item is council initiated item uh to partner with the school board for a pilot school zone safety improvements. And I'll recognize council member bons.

Thank you so much, Mayor. Thank you, mayor, for being my second. I appreciate it. But um I also have to give credit to um Council Member Craig. She also has been a big champion. We have been discussing a lot about this and I know Mayor Pro Tam Bush. I know um Council Member um Richards, we had a conversation recently and you extended support. Sorry I didn't talk to both of you because I didn't have time, but um I've been a big proponent of um partnering with Wake County School Board on several issues because I genuinely feel that school um um even though we don't have direct um decision or control over what the decisions are made in the the school level. Schools are very important part of our ecosystem. Um and they add um they're very important for good quality of life. Um we h we definitely have to find things which are mutually beneficial for for both the parties but in the end it it's um beneficial for our residents. Sorry my voice is husky now. I'm sleepy. I sleep at 9:00 p.m. So, um, so I, um, this whole conversation started when Ryan E, who was the my predecessor, who started working on Panther Creek's um, um, uh, uh, safety

projects and now he's part of the staff and he brought me up to speed and we both are kind of pushing that project forward. that triggered several conversations like how what we do what what what can we do if or can we reduce the speed of these roads? Can we block this left turn lane? Can we adjust this side so that the traffic flows from here? So there have been lot of conversations. Enforcement has been a part of the discussion on um how do we enforce one of the conversations I remember um that Cassie you mentioned about um the the cameras that are being tested right now and that could help us with enforcement of speed and something that you know town is looking at. Um there were other conversations about oh by the way we can put all these measures in place but if students um who are new drivers are um not following the rules and they're distracted then these you know accidents are going to happen and we have to continue to invest into educating um the students but also the parents who drop off these kids in middle of the road sometimes. And you know our police department has mentioned that it is a big problem. So that kind of triggered the whole thought process that we need to come up with a plan for some of these safety campaigns. But I was more focused on some of the schools that are in my district. But I had a a conversation with Councilwoman Craig and she was on board that let's start some education campaign for the new student drivers. And um while we were all addressing the issues specifically um you know related to like I was dealing with Panther Creek, you're dealing with West Kerry Middle, you're probably green hope you know so we all had our own challenges but there are certain similarities that we can

actually look into and try to implement that across the board in all the schools and that's when um um school board chair Tyler Swanson called me and um you, I believe, and the mayor to talk about what can we do, how do we progress this item together as one team, which was a big win for us because that was never the case where we worked on these kind of things together. And I just spoke to Tyler Swanson. He was very excited about this. Um, I would really like for us to think about how do we implement these controls. Um, and you know, tried some education campaign. I know we have had multiple conversations in the background, but this is more of a formal ask now uh where we can direct our staff to kind of bring back some of the items um you know that we can enforce across the board like you know how do we reduce the speed? How do we implement these cameras for enforcement? Is there an education campaign that we can run across the board and start like pushing material about you know safe driving and things like those? So that was my my view. Mayor, you were my second. So

well, I second it because I think partnerships are always a better solution than trying to go things on your own. My only caution is, as you mentioned earlier, this is not our responsibility. I don't want to take ownership, but if we can ask our staff, hey, can you work with the school board to help come up with a pilot program? Yeah, that's a great idea. Let's let's do that.

That's the intention.

Yeah. without without taking ownership or a lot of cost.

Yeah, we're not Yes. We're not saving the world here.

Yeah. So, if if other council members don't have anything, you might want to make a motion to Okay. I'll make a motion and direct the staff to bring some ideas, work with the Wake County School Board and come up with a pilot

program perhaps on education or enforcement or anything that you feel could help the situation you could bring back to the council for uh further discussion

and I'll second it. Discussion.

All in favor?

I.

Any oppose? Motion carries. Thank you. We now move to our third discussion item which was about gosh my eyes are getting blurry now

temporary moratorum on new data centers and I'll recognize mayor pro Bush with this one.

Thank you mayor. Um so I'll go quickly because I know it's late. Um um my goal is to temporarily pause um very large data centers in Kerry including AI Data Centers. Um and the reason is first nearby communities like Apex and Orange County um Durham just um also put in a moratorum have adopted one-year pauses so that they can study how these facilities affect the land use, roads, water, utilities and the environment. Um and then that way that pause is in place so that we can then update our rules. Um at the state level just to be aware Josh Stein uh Governor Josh Stein also has announced that uh they are also paying closer attention to it as well. So obviously we don't want to get ahead or behind you know and then have to change it but I do think that at by putting in a temporary moratorum which by the way I had to look it up moratorum is temporary so I guess I'm redundant there. Um but that would also help us um understand how data centers affect all of you know electricity demand etc. it matters a lot to carry because if you're s you know why does that matter to carry well we do have some industrial area and some green

field space where a data center could be built but more importantly uh Jordan Lake is our is our watershed it it is our drinking water and 770,000 people rely on Jordan Lake for water in our region so it is a finite resource um that we share with our neighbors so in order to be good neighbors we And because largecale D centers use a substantial amount of water for cooling, um this is a wise decision to to put it um to put it lightly to to do something like this. Um so what I'm proposing what I'll make um well I will wait to see if anybody else wants to comment on it but my idea is that we would propose that we would direct staff to study the issue in depth come back to us with recommendations and this moratorum may have to be time limited I'm guessing yes

um would have to be time limited and um that way staff could come back with some given us changes that we might have to make to our ordinances So, it's really

motion

that that could be a motion, but

I'll second it. [laughter]

Time limited.

Yeah, I would ask for a little clarification. Um, it sounds like a two-step process.

Yes.

The first, as I understood the initial request, is to u ask staff to initiate the process to do a moratorum. There is a public hearing process. Things that have to happen. That's step one. a if you then adopt that at a future meeting, staff would then do the study and the bring back, you know, how we would incorporate data centers into the policy.

So, it's kind of a two-step process. So, tonight you would be authorizing.

By the way, Apex did a more a temporary moratorum

without this without the ordinances. So, they

it's a two-step process. You do the moratorium first,

okay? and say we you know we're putting a moratorium on data centers while we

while we study

while we study but you do put a time limit on the moratorum. So this would be taking step one directing staff to come back to you with a staff report a recommended timeline for the moratorum how long would it last um and you would have a public hearing on that and vote on that at a future council meeting.

If you vote to approve that then the moratorum would start and then staff would begin work on the ordinance.

So that's what you meant. That's what I That is exactly what I meant.

That's what I understood. Second.

Okay.

Discussion. All in favor, please say I.

I.

Any oppose? Motion carries unanimously. Now we're going into close session.

Okay. Pursuant

Pursuant to GS 143. Uh oh, it's different.

I thought you had it memorized.

I do have it memorized, but I always have to look and see what she wrote on it. Not at 114

because she [clears throat] changes it. Uh 143 318 11a 1 3 and 6. I move that we close to close session to consult with attorneys employed by and or retained by the town in order to preserve the town the attorney client privilege between the attorneys and the town to prevent the disclosure of information that made privileged or confidential pursuant to the laws of the state or not considered a public record within the meaning of chapter 132 of the general statutes and to consider the qualifications competence performance character fitness conditions of employment or conditions of employment of initial employment of one or more individuals. public officers employees.

There's a motion,

second

and a second. Discussion. All in favor, please say I. Any oppose? Motion carries. We're going into close session back here.

Bless you.

We'll reconvene our council meeting at this time. We have no further business for this evening. I would entertain a motion to adjurnn.

So moved.

Motion second. Discussion. All in favor, please say I. I.

Any oppose? Motion carries and we are done.